Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Do you use a CD player any more?

I am rowing against the flow on this one.

Perhaps it matters which CD player and which system?

I had a G08 feeding DSP 7200s but realised I got nowhere near the sound quality I had heard at Bristol. Now with an 808i.2 the sound has been transformed, as you would hope given the investment! But the 8081.2 has added better upsampling and resolution enhancement, apodizing, better FIFOs, better power supplies, balanced digital output via SpeakerLink and also MHR (and probably some other things I have forgotten to mention or am ignorant of). At present, I don't think servers can do this.

I can play my iPod on the system for downloads and rips via a �10 Cambridge dock. It sounds pretty good.

Do people with servers think that they all sound the same (a bit like the old argument that all CD players sound the same)? It would be good to hear of some ranking or discrimination here if possible from those who have tried different set-ups.

I think it is quite possible that all servers do not sound the same. I think one issue may be jitter caused by a poorly implemented power supply and other factors. Stereophile measured the McIntosh MS750 music server at 14ns (14,000ps). The Black Box by Blue Smoke is advertised jitter of "less than 1ns" (1000ns). Stereophile measured the Sooloos as having 254ps of jitter. The problem is that short of buying a Miller Audio Jitter Analyzer, I don't know how you would measure the jitter of you DIY server. There may be other issues present as well.

But with the 808.2 you're basically putting a much better preamp in their. I think you'd find if you slipped G68 or 861 in there (between G08 and DSP7200) you would have found similar results. Minus the apodizing stuff which we have not quantified yet and may eventually get in processors as well. Most folks have a processor between their music server and speakers doing similar work the preamp is doing in the 808.2. You changed two large variables when you made that change. Not just a "source".

Yes, but that is why I use it as a CD player and why I assume it will sound better than a server.

I'm still firmly in the CD spinner camp. I can't find anything else to tweak on Squeezecentre, the SB3 or the wireless connection...it just doesn't sound as good as either the 500/518 or the 598. It's not night and day, but having spent so much time and money on the rest of the system, why would I want to throw away 10-15% worth of performance? I'm not dead against server solutions, I just need to hear one which sounds as good as the players themselves.

The other issue I have is in the choosing of music. It was noted earlier (and has been by many) that it's easy to burn through 30 or so tracks on random before finding something you like. I find that quite distracting, and much prefer browsing my CDs (or will do when they are all unpacked again!). Maybe it's an age thing, but I can't remember the ~700 CDs I have in my collection, and scrolling through the SB3 "Albums" display doesn't inspire. The sad fact is that I've listened to a lot less music with the SB3 than I did when I had access to my discs.

Ever the contrarian!

George

I have to say that I do not hear any difference all with classic, progressive rock which is what I primarily listen to via my Kaleidescape. It could not be easier. In so far as metadata, I never heard any difference when I was ripping to AIFF (same as WAV) using itunes. It ripped DTS CDs so it seemed to me that it was bit for bit accurate. Now, I am not going to say that these systems will get you to the absolute pinnacle of "data integrity" which is what M is all about, but for my use, its either the same or so close that I cannot discern and the ease of use of a server really makes it a no brainer.

This is where things get interesting because many (all?) of the digital processing features of the 808i.2 are also in the 7200s. Did you use the upsampled output from your G08? Because if you did, you wouldn't have benefitted from the 7200s apodizing... The jitter from the G08 isn't going to match the benchmark levels of the 808i.2+SpeakerLink, but it's going to be pretty good! The only question I have is whether or not the 7200s resolution enhance when they upsample 16-bit material (because I don't think the G08 will resolution enhance at standard sampling rates).

Depends if you have apodizing speakers. If not, the 808.2 will probably rule everything (assuming that apodizing is all it's cracked up to be).

Hello Meridian Fanz,

I seem to fit your profile, but your conclusions do not apply to me.

"I don't think that it's about wether or not you are a computer enthusiast, because the ease of use is already there. You don't need to be an enthusiast to set this up. You just need to be computer literate these days."
I am very basically competent on my computer as an operator as our nomadic lifestyle requires me to run our lives on 3 laptops in 2 countries, but useless with computer set up. It is a huge, fun and lenghty process for me to try to understand this whole server concept. I wish you were correct, but unfortunately in my experience you are terribly wrong.

"I think that Sooloss appeals to those people who simply want someone else to do it for them. They don't want to set up or tweak their own system,"
I am absolutely a DIY'er, so it has to be plug and play for me.

"and they aren't critical listeners either."
OUCH!

"They don't know what room correction or upsampling is either."
I do so! I hired the Canadian distributor to come over on the ferry and set it up for me because the process was over my head and it was worth every penny.

"It's the convenience and luxury over iTunes GUI, sonos, etc., and they are prepared to pay for it. There is a kind of hi-fi customer who isn't really into hi-fi."
No! It's the sound! Ask my wife how eclectic she thinks the 8k's with the tilted heads look in our small condo with the 5200's sticking into the corridors, but she also won't settle for any less sound quality.

"Now if you just so happen to have the money to burn, and the kind of room with Creston/AMX consoles etc., then by all means get a Sooloos. But for your normal audiophile, I'm curious about who in that 50% is looking to trade up now that Meridian owns the company."
I don't have the money to burn, but I am looking to exchange my G91 for the Sooloos Ensemble as the entry level Sooloos, as long as I benefit from the convenience without sacrificing sound. That seems to be the hot debate at the moment.

I am diligently pursuing several processes to understand this issue so that in the near future I can make an informed decision to wade in. I hope that my fellow hitchhikers continue to understand and appreciate that there are neophytes like me so that I will one day secure the holy grail.

Neophytes are a good thing. An occasional "I'm just interested in the music; how do I get the best sound?" gets our priorities back in focus.

I voted CD, but the way in which I want to access my music is certainly changing. I`m just not doing the majority of listening in one place in the house anymore. I need more options. As a consequence I`m very much interested in exploring the ways of the Squeezebox…etc, but not until I know my 500 transport (3xx serial. Does that make it a Mk3? I really don`t know) could get a good home. Only then would I even have some free funds to put towards and SB3 and so on. Problem is the market for CD transports seems slim now given the growing popularity of streaming options.

I listen to an awful lot of film music and classical music, and so I own a lot of multi-disc sets and, certainly as far as some of the albums in my film music collection are concerned, music is often out of sequence on a CD. Storing lossless encodes on a server would certainly alleviate those playback frustrations since I could arrange them for playback as I see fit.

I`d add that I have no interest in actual downloads however. So long as a CD is available I will buy it, and rip that to a server. I will always love having a physical collection of discs, and even with a server I'd still keep my collection on display.

For me the problem with the server option would be accessing sleeve notes, so for now I'm sticking with ye olde disc spinner. Oh, and there's no way to rip SACDs.

Mark S

"M Fanz, May I draw your attension the the threads on Meta data and problems associated when useing FLAC.
I myself had trouble and after pouring hours into ripping and trying to label as I wanted, and have given up on the idea for now.

You do have to know your way around a computer and be prepaired to do it.
Technophobes cant and wont, but they may well be interested in sound quality also having dealers instal using MRC etc."

If you went down the FLAC/EAC route, you may have a point. But, that route is not absolutely necessary - it's more like an insurance policy for those who are concerned there might be something wrong out there. I have all confidence in iTunes ripping, and tagging meets my needs. I think Winamp was good too if I recall correctly.

I agree about technophobes, but there is a huge range between being a computer enthusiast and being a technophobe!