Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Hardware upgrade of the G68 processor family ?

Has there been ANY hardware upgrades to the G68 series ? I know there are different versions, and that the G68 at least looks like it can be hardware upgraded from the look on the rear panel (card style slots...). But has it happened ?

From my point of view, the things I think is needed to keep the G68 family in the place it belongs so to speak, is to correct:

1) HDMI input for sound processing, and please remove Composit video at least...
2) NEW DAC's to support better resolution
3) The new filter design ("apodizing"), however it stil need's a serious DAC upgrade

I can only speak for my self, and my experince from other non-Meridian components like the Benchmark DAC-1, which is a DAC which is a magnitude better in performance. It's like getting a Ferrari (or Porsche) and a freeway to drive it on - it's simlpy superior. BUT it's not WAF - my fiance does simply not accept that aproach of the stereo system..... One remote only...

Anyway, the question I'm trying to find out is: Have there been an upgrade program, ever, for the G-series ? or are they dead products ?

So you are saying the Benchmark DAC-1 is 10 times better. That's quite a statement. How did you campare? Did you deafeat the dithering in the G68 to do an apples to apples comparison? The dithering in the G68 gives a "warmer" less detailed sound but also MUCH less fatiguing.

One way to compare would be to run the DSP outputs on your G68 into your DAC-1. Set the G68 to non 24/96 DSP speakers. Then you can compare the quality of the DACs based on the SAME inputs. Also be sure to use single ended on your DAC-1. Running a CD player into G68 with dithering and single ended vs the DAC-1 has way to many other variables to do a comparison of the DACs themselves.

No G68 has been hardware upgraded yet.

Your G68 only has single ended, to get the most out of analog you want to go balanced.

Let's wait to get answers from John K on apodizing. We don't know what makes sense on apodizing filters yet. And a existing G68 may even get it, we don't know yet.

Lars, if you're not careful, we might think you are from a competitor's company...

There has been at least one running changes in spec. to the G68: The addition of a USB audio input.

With respect to item 2 "NEW DAC's to support better resolution":

Better specs you mean. Better specs does not necessarily translate to better perceivable resolution.

Let's say for arguments sake that we have a DAC, the AD1853, with a "poor" 104dB of Signal to Noise Ratio. Additionally, we want to deliver that entire dynamic range in our listening rooms.

If we want to experience the full dynamic range of this DAC and limit ourselves to "reference levels" for a full range loudspeaker which is 105dB SPL at the seat we need to have a baseline noise level of 1dB SPL. The term for this is "anechoic chamber" which is reported to not actually be very good for listening to music (or movies).

Now, let's move on to a Burr-Brown with better specs. We'll take the PCM1789, which specs as having 1.5 bits more of resolution at 113dB SNR. To experience the full range of this DAC we have to have a noise floor of -8dB SPL.

If we move this into real "quiet" rooms, they tend to be in the 20dB range for the baseline noise. To experience the full range of the AD DAC you're going to hit 124dB of SPL. For the Burr-Brown, it's 133dB of SPL. I can't speak for you, but I don't ever want anything that loud around me without hearing protection.

At what point is it enough?

I don't have a problem with wanting to eke every bit of performance out of a system, but I'm also somewhat realistic.

The other thing is that M has said that they prefer the sonic qualities of the DAC they use although other solutions do in fact spec better.

Last year I bought a Benchmark DAC-1 because of all the raves.

The DAC-1 is a completely different animal from a Meridian processor and I most definitely wouldn't describe it as "better".

If you want a bare bones/simple stereo DAC for $1k, then the Benchmark DAC-1 is a great solution. But in my opinion the DAC-1 is not a Meridian processor competitor.

In my home the DAC-1 was delegated as a DAC for my Mac. But IMHO it was total overkill and I am now selling it.

using Meridian DSPs makes G68's DACs irrelevant.

Ivan:

It's the same DAC anyway for current loudspeakers.

Now THAT is something I like, I might just change from the banking business to developing hardware for Meridians competitors....


I did not as for changes in spec. I asked if there has EVER been an hardware upgrade program, or that was what I'm after anyway. Like when TAG, once upon a time, offered there upgrade path for there processor AV32R.

Well I wrote magnitude - you write 10 times - yea yea difference maybe, the point is something else


Blind, without knowing what system I listened to - had, of course, help from my fiance (yes, she does now enough to handle both systems, she just hated one of them - and that is not the Meridian since it survived)


Most likly no. I can't remember and I don't have the profile stored on my computer anymore (damn disc crash).

From Your point of view, what settings would you recommend for PSM signal (that is G98DH for CDs and my SPDIF interface from SB3) ? I can try to make a new evaluation although I currently do not have access to any Benchmark DAC-1, but I guess I could buy the new DAC-1 Pre (with USB interface) just for the fun of testing.


I have no DSP Speakers, nor will I ever get anyone

If I would do a test, I would run a CD-drive (G98DH, SPDIF output) and SB3 to SPDIF input on the Benchmark DAC-1 Pre against the G68ADV (with MHR for G98 and SPDIF for the SB3) - lot of choices here, not to mention setup of the G68ADV properties. The Amps will be Meridian G-series, with active filter for the Infra system (bas). It's not so simple to explain, but let's say this: I have full respons from about 11Hz to +22kHz - of course with effects from the room. And by the way I would not use MRC for this, although I could of course...


Just as I thought. I guess this, in a way, indicates that there might not be any upgrades for the hardware for the G68. It's a dead product from that perspective.


Exactly. But without apodizing or any other upgrades the G68 is dead. Just as the G61R - just about all G-series are dead.

I most likly will never do any measures with instruments for any specs verification - other people does this so why should I ?

Every person has there own reference. Every person has his or hers personal taste. Therefore I might like the, what would call, neutrality of the Benchmark against the slight colored version the G68 puts out. Does this mean the spec is better ? Maybe, it's just that the resolution is not up to the best of current products - however I would say this: Current implementation of DAC + filter for the G68 is good enough for the majority of people. I use it, just as an example. But that does not mean I would not like to get it improved. And there is room for improvment.

Meridian has offered upgrade paths for the 565, 561, 568 and 861 surround sound processors, and most of its other components going back for more than a decade. Although no upgrade path has been announced for the G68, given Meridian's history, an upgrade for the G68 is a good possibility, but not a certainty. What technology other than an USB input, which I bet if you paid Meridian the right price they would do for you, has warranted it prior to the introduction of the HD621? I don't expect an HD621 on a card for the 861 or the G68 given Bob's stated opinion that putting video processing other than simple switching in a surround sound processor is a bad idea.

Minor, but importent detail: When I evaluated the Meridian G68 against the Benchmark DAC-1 USB (which was the version I had at hand at that day) in combo with an all analog preamp, I used my dedicated room which was constructed for a good respons and which was close to absolut quiet (there was a slight background noise, however it was very very low and most did not notice it...). I guess there are better rooms than that one, however I stil have only found 2 (!) rooms equal that room. However, life moves and my current room does not have the acoustics.