Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Theta Casablanca III

Anyone heard this? Opinions? Opinions vs. M processors?

Thanks.

Friend of mine has the CIII and the same main speakers, but obviously his room is different so it is hard to make any definitive comparative conclusions. I prefer the overall sound of my 861 (but I would think that, wouldn't I?) although he has certainly had less maintenance problems with his CIII. I also employ all digital sources and have grown fond of listening to 2-channel sources through Trifield - something CIII cannot match.

Was an M owner for many years, but sitting it out for the moment w/an Onkyo 9.8. Plotting my way back upscale, and have been offered a really good deal on a current III w/the pending upgrade.

Also considering coming back to M obviously and maybe Classe. Very tough to audition this stuff in a legitimate way.

Agreed, the general decline of specialty audio/video shops has made it very difficult to borrow componenents and demo them in your own listening environment - plus these hi-end processors are so tricky to setup properly that a demo becomes problematic. Trying to hear the small differences when comparing equipment across multiple listening rooms (IMO the effect of the room dwarfs differences in component performance) makes an objective assessment impossible.

As sacreligious as this may seem, I think one really ends up picking based on things like pricing deals, unique features (i.e. Trifield), and company stability - rather than sound differences. It is atually shocking how many times I have bought an expensive piece of equipment without ever actually having heard it!

Comparison demos are virtually impossible. No dealer has the combination of processors, disc spinners, amplifiers and speakers your going to want to listen to head-to-head. I bought my 541 and 506 after a demo in 1996. I haven't felt the need for more demos as I continued my Meridian journey to my present setup. I guess that makes me a disciple.

Although I had heard a (wonderful) system with a G68 at it's heart, I bought mine without a dedicated demo. I wanted to go the Meridian route based on my experience with the 561 and other M kit (including a pair of 18-bit DSP5000s) and found an ex-dem unit at such a bargain price that, until recently, I could have completely recouped the cost. It's probably the one component that I don't ever think about when I appraise my system; it just sits there and does everything (apart from HDMI ) wonderfully.

It's an excellent processor, very close to the 861. Some things are not as good, others are better than the 861.

I think your choice really depends on what you want to do with it and what configurations we're talking about. Are you going to use the Premium, Superior II or Xtreme DACs? Do you need a Sixshooter for analogue multichannel? It has no room correction which might be an issue for some, not for others. So the question is, do you need MRC? Are you still using other MHR sources? Those can't be used with the Casablanca III.

Some like Trifield, back when Trifield was something new for me, I really enjoyed it. But over the years I have to say, the better speakers I got, the less I was using Trifield. You can do alot with Trifield if your speakers don't have a very wide soundstage and if the imaging isn't that good. That's when Trifield really shines. If you're really into 2-channel music, you may even want to consider adding a dedicated 2-channel pre-amp (such as the Audio Research Ref III) to your chain, to get the best out of your system.

But back to the Theta, I think if you don't need anything Meridian specific, such as MRC or MHR, then you're not gonna miss anything in comparison to the 861. It's an excellent processor and with the upcoming HDMI upgrade, it's on the very top of the to-buy list.

We all know now that Meridian has something in the pipeline for HDMI. If they wouldn't have had this box at Cedia, I probably would have bought the Theta myself.

Yes, you pretty much have to buy w/o audition these days -- so it's a price, features, intuition thing. Did this w/M and was very happy, but is there any other product out there where you spend 10K+ so blindly?

Thanks for the opin. on Theta -- great to know you think it's on the 861 level. It's cheaper for me to go that route.

I'm sold out of Meridian at the moment, 598/G68 (and the 568.2mm before it) all gone so it's a clean slate; no MHR. Speakers have always been analog.

Considerations:

I like Trifield, am well setup for it, but my experience is as noted above; I used it less and less over time -- better for some recordings, worse for others. A definite consideration, but probably not a deal breaker. MRC was useful, but very subtle in my old, somewhat treated room. New room has better sound treatment -- I'd expect it to be less of a factor and my sub (JL f113) has some correction, though not as flexible, built-in.

If I go Theta, it would be the Extreme DAC for the fronts, center, and sub, Premium DAC for all surrounds. I've heard mixed things whether the Extreme is comparable to an excellent standalone DAC for music -- for any of these processors I have my Audio Aero to compare. Would be nice to get it all though in one simple box. The Theta and G68/861 are different though roughly comparable in the setup/control parameters they offer.

I want to get back to vinyl down the road which necessitates a separate preamp w/M (digitized analog inputs). The Theta Six Shooter, though more than I need channel-wise is by all accounts a great SS analog preamp, and integrates effortlessly w/the CBIII. At 2K before discount, given its reputed performance (again, can't really audition), it's a good deal w/better ergonomics vs. a separate preamp. Not much detail on how Theta is going to handle HDMI w/the announced upgrade -- separate off the audio to deal w/jitter as M is doing?, etc. -- but probably safe to trust a company like Theta on this.

The Classe SSP 800 also has some appeal. Used to own a Proceed AVP; a great processor in its day with excellent 2 channel performance and the smartest ergonomics (albeit w/fewer setup/ control options than the G68, for ex.) of any processor I've owned before or since. The 800 is largely by the same design team as the AVP. Claimed to have first-rate music performance and an excellent analog preamp section. A Classe amp I heard some years ago had clearly rolled off highs to sound 'warmer' and less fatiguing; I was not impressed but this is flimsy as a reason to buy or not buy the 800.

Back to M -- I thought the G68 was excellent for movies and love the control Meridian gives to tailor the sound. Though good, it didn't match my AA DAC for music, but this is to be expected given that the AA costs half as much as the G. If I went down this road again and got vinyl as planned, I'd probably find a good used tube preamp. Was looking at an Aestethix Callipso at one time, about 2.7K used. With or w/o the preamp but including the HDMI box (whenever), this would be my most expensive option; the 861 much more so.

Small thing, but nice is OSD. Have it w/the Onkyo, had it w/the Proceed AVP, Lexicon MC12 in the past. Very handy to see db levels on screen for channel trimming, etc. M no, Classe yes, Theta maybe.

Anyway, choices are starting to present themselves as the situation clears a bit. Have to move on the Theta by the end of the month for the great pricing.

Don't let anyone kid you btw, the greater resolution of the new formats really pays off.

Something that seems to be pretty unique to Meridian processors is the FIFO processing to reduce jitter.

Anthem seems to make a point about how they handle the digital signal

Does anyone know what Theta and Classe do in this regard?

Stepping down from this, I've always wondered what processors like Sunfire or flagship receivers by Denon, Pioneer, Onkyo and Yamaha do in this regard.

http://www.thetadigital.com/product/cb3/whats-new.htm

Theta's proprietary “Jitter Jail” digitally stores audio samples in a buffer, then clocks them to the DACs using a high quality crystal oscillator section. Virtually eliminates all jitter on incoming signals.

Looks like the Casablanca does FIFO too...

"Looks like the Casablanca does FIFO too... "

That isn't uncommon. Some/many DSPs process in several word chunks at a time so the audio data is buffered into memory to feed the DSPs so it can be fed in the blocks.

Shawn

And DD/DTS/MLP/HDMI etc themselves, being packet based, are effectively FIFO buffered.