Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Power cables into DSP's...not the snakeoil or fact question

Steve H

there are quite a few reasons why I decided to stay as-is with cables. In no particular order:-

-I was overdue on the loan pairs and rather than make a rush decision I sent them back (Thanks to Missing Link should they read this)
-there was no clear winner even though the sound did change very subtly
-the degree of change wasn't worth (to me) �400 either in absolute terms or relative to the cost of the DSP's especially as I could be definitive about the sound I preferred
-I was mulling over many of the responses here (thanks for all of those, esp george M...they were very helpful if challenging at times)
-the perception of the degree of change in cables did vary day by day....depending on what was in my belly, daily stresses in my head and also what type CD I was playing amongst many other variables I'd guess
-I was beginning to subscribe to the chrislayeruk school of thought and wanted to get back to enjoying the music (cheers Chris )
-actually all the cords sounded good, or should I say the 8k's sounded good regardless. Was I worrying about the thickness of the souls of my shoes stood on top of Mt Everest ???
-thinking about the live switching of two rigs (as per Mark H's comments) I just tested the setup I'd done a week or so before whereby 598 goes straight into D1 and also via G68/MRC into D2 of the 8k's. Pressing CD or DVD toggles between them whilst a disc is playing. Doing this makes an enourmous difference (for many reasons) which put the scale of changes I was trying to track down into some sort of persepctive (a little voice in the back of my head had had enough and was telling me to get a life ).
-Other tweaks, like speaker placement, toe-in etc, make for much greater changes too (in my system).

Incidentally, I chatted with Mark at Missing Link a while ago and indeed he does not make any claims about what his cables will actually do. He indicated a purely technical approach to what each cable can do electrically including measurments. It was possibly that approach which triggered my original question.


So, this leaves me much where I started. I believe that power cables can alter sound. I am still curious about why this is and exactly what is going on with all of the above tech-talk. Some people will no doubt hear enough beneficial change to make it absolutely worthwhile (not me on this occasion). Some people will also have bought them regardless, hear nothing yet feel great about what they have. Nothing wrong with any of that I reckon.

Cheers all.

PS keep the tech-talk coming if you have it...

Hi Nick, I like the finish there.

It sounds like the end of a good Poirot, all the suspects in the room whilst Hercule explains the journey taken by his "Little Grey Cells".

I never really understand it, but somehow find it all very satisfying indeed.

Cheers for the question, Chris

Nick,

A jolly good debate, and well moderated at that. Anyone would think you'd chaired a couple of meetings at work in your time...

Although your instincts on the mains cable matter veer towards the snakeoil camp, fair-play to you for being open minded enough to give them a try. At any rate, it is reassuring to know that the engineering integrity in the 8000s is sufficient to leave no room for a �200 cable to improve matters

The whole area of mains treatment is very interesting, and having posted previously on Isotek products, I've heard the Titan make a good improvement to DSP6000s, an excellent improvement to DSP5500s, but kill a 559 amp stone dead. Which, like the cable debate here, rather suggests that all such tweaks need to be tried in the context of your own system...the reviews really do count for nothing in this instance!

Cheers

George

I too have been troubled by the justification for spending large sums of money on power cables, when often a bit of cable management will be more productive. I do run a dedicated ring main to my components and utilise a filter - all of which makes perfect sense.

As regards the mains cables (about �85 a pop) I was fortunate enough to meet a gentleman today who is a recording engineer at Abbey Road Studios, with 35 years experience to hand.

The majority of his equipment at home is Meridian and the power cables are also Meridian. His views on expensive mains cables, which also applied to digital cables, were that they are a waste of money.

Now, having engineered many of the most acclaimed classical recordings in one of the best environments, my guess is that he knows what it should sound like. If his trained ear can't detect worthwhile improvement in expensive mains cables, mine certainly won't.

On the other hand, if I had spent �100s on replacement cables, I might yet convince myself that there was an improvement.

The supplied Meridian cable is a good cable. Could it be that anything else is perhaps excessive. Personally I am saving my money for an HD DVD transport when they finally arrive.

See also:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/badscience/0,12993,921771,00.html

Mark S

very amusing article.

i'm with mr. goldacre on this one. save your money. spend the effort positioning your speakers properly for your room

doody.

The purpose of power cables (expensive or not) in a hifi system is to provide clean and dependable juice and, most important, to improve the sound. And that's what most cable manufacturers claim. Most of them don't claim that their products measure better compared to the ordinary kettle cord.

If it sounds better than it is better. Listen to it and make up your own mind. And that's what Mr. Ben Goldacre should have done (only he didn't). Besides, I think there are measurement methods which proove that there is a difference between dedicated hifi cables and ordinary kettle cables.

I might stir some water here, but as far as my pretty extended experience goes, there is a difference and - with the better cords - an improvement. I've heard it on many occasions in many systems with dozens of people. Repeatedly. Comparing power cords isn't that easy since most high end components don't like to be switchted on an off in quick succession.

I (for one) prefer the less nervous sound of a dedicated hifi cable and the superior three-dimensionality (sound- and picture-wise).

My advice to all: Make up your own mind and try before you buy.

-m

Ben Goldacre has not dismissed anything out of hand, he has asked for some proof.
If someone can pass a rigorous blind test that would be proof. This request has been made for years on all sorts of hifi trickery and to date no one has passed. In fact very very few actually try, then tend to cry off.

So I dont think Mr Goldacre has asked anything that hasnt been asked before.

Could you provide some links or references to the measurements you mention as I would be very interested to read them.
Thanks

Guys, Nick (ncpl) made it quite clear at the outset of this thread that this was not to be a "yes they do", "no they don't" type debate. Everyone made a good job of exploring the reasons why cables might make a difference when we had thsi discussion prior to Christmas, so let's not drag it back to the "Oh yes it is, Oh no it's not" pantomime level now.

Cheers

George

Apologies if the link I posted yesterday has steered this thread into more polemical waters. I guess I should have started a new thread.

Anyway, I thought it was useful to get a "civilian's" perspective of the power cord debate.

Mark S

"..I've heard the Titan make a good improvement to DSP6000s, an excellent improvement to DSP5500s, but kill a 559 amp stone dead".

George,

Dramatic claims like these do tend to foster the 'yes, it does; no, it doesn't' type of responses.

I assume in the case of the 559, that the fuse in the power cord had gone as this is the only circumstance I can think of where a power cord could make such a dramatic difference to the sound output.

Cliff

Fair point Cliff, it should have been put as:

"I have heard the Titan make subjective gains for DSP speakers (more so for the DSP5500 than DSP6000), yet adversely affect the subjective timing ability of a 559 amp."

Bloody pedant.

Cheers

George