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Joined: Apr 2012
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Hooloovoo
Hooloovoo
Joined: Apr 2012
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Hm, so John Williams Conducts His Classic Scores from the Films of Steven Spielberg, John Williams, Boston Pops was only ever MQA 44.1 on Tidal and Roon, not hi-res. Now Tidal reports Max, Roon authenticates MQA 44.1…

So is “Max” reporting even red book MQA as higher res than “High”?

If so, that’s gonna drive the MQA witch-hunters into a frenzy 😁


HC: 861v4/ID40/LPS, DSP5000, DSP5000VC, DSP3100, SW1600, HD621, Oppo BDP-105, Sony VPL-HW55ES
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President of the Imperial Galactic Government
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,816
Likes: 87
Originally Posted by 3dit0r
Not sure that Max in Tidal isn’t now a cover-all term for anything over 16/44.

I checked and most (all?) of my MQA albums in Tidal are now labelled Max in the Tidal app, when they were MQA the other day. However, Roon still reports, and authenticates/unfolds an MQA stream on the same albums, at least on the ones I’ve checked…

Yes....seems to be a catch all.

Having updated the desktop Tidal app earlier I would say that Tidal and Roon are not yet aligned (as stated by Roon on their forum also).

e.g. If I play Travis Scott's latest via Roon I get MQA96 as Tidal favourite (my Son's I might add not mine) but if I play the same Tidal favourited album via the desktop app into my Prime then I get no MQA. Same Tidal fave album in both cases.

This is very unsatisfactory IMO. If Roon aligns with Tidal (which I expect they will have to) then I/we will have no control/choice over which format we are sent to play.

Notice also that Master Quality section is also gone from Tidal.

Tidal's FAQ states that Hi-Res FLAC will take precedence over MQA and implies the user will have no choice in this matter.


Rgds,
Nick


Joined: Feb 2002
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President of the Imperial Galactic Government
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,816
Likes: 87
@3ditor

Yes... the irony in that it's actually funny. The anti-MQA mob who have been after killing it forever, are now, likely to get served MQA when they didn't ask for it.

That means both camps likely to be unhappy.


Rgds,
Nick


Joined: Apr 2012
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Hooloovoo
Hooloovoo
Joined: Apr 2012
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Originally Posted by ncpl
Yes....seems to be a catch all.

Having updated the desktop Tidal app earlier I would say that Tidal and Roon are not yet aligned (as stated by Roon on their forum also).

e.g. If I play Travis Scott's latest via Roon I get MQA96 as Tidal favourite (my Son's I might add not mine) but if I play the same Tidal favourited album via the desktop app into my Prime then I get no MQA. Same Tidal fave album in both cases.

Does Roon cache Tidal material, then, or is it streamed direct from Tidal servers?

If it’s streamed direct, this would imply that Roon is incorrectly authenticating a non-MQA stream?


HC: 861v4/ID40/LPS, DSP5000, DSP5000VC, DSP3100, SW1600, HD621, Oppo BDP-105, Sony VPL-HW55ES
2-Channel: Oppo BDP-105, TEAC VRDS-7/Trichord Clock 3/PSU, 551, Quad 303, Harbeth Compact 7ES-3, Kimber cables, Russ Andrews mains and supports.
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Don't Panic!
Don't Panic!
Joined: Apr 2004
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Not incorrectly authenticating. The headline format is based on historic Roon analysis of the files. Clearly, many of those analyses are or are going to become wrong. The Roon signal path will always give you the precise format during playback.


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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Hooloovoo
Hooloovoo
Joined: Apr 2012
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Likes: 171
It was the Roon signal path I was going from, though…

Same albums on Tidal:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


HC: 861v4/ID40/LPS, DSP5000, DSP5000VC, DSP3100, SW1600, HD621, Oppo BDP-105, Sony VPL-HW55ES
2-Channel: Oppo BDP-105, TEAC VRDS-7/Trichord Clock 3/PSU, 551, Quad 303, Harbeth Compact 7ES-3, Kimber cables, Russ Andrews mains and supports.
Previous Meridian: 5000C, 5200SL, 7200.2, 6000, 562V.2, 568.2mm, 800v4, 808.2i, 818v2/v3, 861v8, 502
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Don't Panic!
Don't Panic!
Joined: Apr 2004
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Likes: 88
In that case, different streams for now. We don't cache anything from TIDAL.


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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President of the Imperial Galactic Government
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,816
Likes: 87
I raised the issue with Tidal via their support desk.

Quote
Thanks for getting in touch with TIDAL Support.

Thank you for sharing your comments with us. TIDAL has always prioritized and invested in superior audio quality. Our commitment to open platforms for both artists and fans drives our adoption of FLAC, and specifically HiRes FLAC as the preferred option for the best sound quality we offer.

In addition to utilizing MQA which this won't disappear, we make use of various high-quality and immersive audio formats, such as Dolby Atmos, to provide our subscribers with a premium listening experience and more artists the opportunity to share their music exactly as it is intended to sound. However, our system will prioritize the HiRes FLAC resolution over the MQA one.

The hierarchy of source file selection is HiRes FLAC > MQA > FLAC. If your audio setting is set to Max, the sample rate shown will depend on your specific device.

If you have any other questions, please let us know.

Quote
Thanks for the reply.
I don’t really understand why you choose to remove my choice. My preference is MQA over the equivalent hi-res FLAC. Now I cannot select my preference.
Why did Tidal not allow the choice?
It makes no sense. You have albums in both flac192 and MQA192 and the latter will never be accessible.
I have tested both and prefer mqa.

Quote
Thank you for getting back to us.

We appreciate you taking the time to share your feedback, and we understand that you will like to select your preferred resolution, MQA. At this time, TIDAL will only display the prioritized sound resolution. We’ll make sure your request gets into the right hands. Your feedback helps us improve, and we appreciate your thoughts!

Thank you,

Quote
Thanks again Paula. I do hope that the appropriate members of the Tidal team receive this feedback.

You can summarise my disappointment as: I pay £20 per month for Tidal because I want MQA and until this week have been able to clearly select it. Now you prevent me from doing that. I respectfully think this is a mistake and not at all customer-centric.

Thank you for your support here.


Suggest if anyone else feels similarly then maybe contacting Tidal may help change the position.

We can but hope


Rgds,
Nick


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Hooloovoo
Hooloovoo
Joined: Apr 2012
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That is not ideal, to say the least.

So, in the case of Roon, is what's going on that if you already favourited/added the MQA version (or have 'prefer MQA over all other formats' in settings) then it still selects the MQA file, if available?

I'll contact Tidal, as well, and add my voice, in any case...


HC: 861v4/ID40/LPS, DSP5000, DSP5000VC, DSP3100, SW1600, HD621, Oppo BDP-105, Sony VPL-HW55ES
2-Channel: Oppo BDP-105, TEAC VRDS-7/Trichord Clock 3/PSU, 551, Quad 303, Harbeth Compact 7ES-3, Kimber cables, Russ Andrews mains and supports.
Previous Meridian: 5000C, 5200SL, 7200.2, 6000, 562V.2, 568.2mm, 800v4, 808.2i, 818v2/v3, 861v8, 502
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Hooloovoo
Hooloovoo
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,177
Likes: 171
Submitted this under a feature request, let's see...


HC: 861v4/ID40/LPS, DSP5000, DSP5000VC, DSP3100, SW1600, HD621, Oppo BDP-105, Sony VPL-HW55ES
2-Channel: Oppo BDP-105, TEAC VRDS-7/Trichord Clock 3/PSU, 551, Quad 303, Harbeth Compact 7ES-3, Kimber cables, Russ Andrews mains and supports.
Previous Meridian: 5000C, 5200SL, 7200.2, 6000, 562V.2, 568.2mm, 800v4, 808.2i, 818v2/v3, 861v8, 502
Joined: Feb 2002
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President of the Imperial Galactic Government
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 8,816
Likes: 87
No, I expect it is worse than that.

If you have a bunch of MQA faves then Tidal will serve you the hi-res FLAC instead. My assumption is that Roon will have to follow Tidal's protocol.

So, for now Roon gives you MQA but I don't see them realistically being able to maintain that if Tidal has changed underneath.


Rgds,
Nick


Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 460
Likes: 18
Paranoid android
Paranoid android
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 460
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All the versions are available still in most cases (not all).
In Roon you can see and select which version you want to play. Click on a song and then versions.


Main: Marantz Cinema 50, Meridian 271, DSP7200.2, DSP5200HC, DSP5000 rears, Meridian 210.
PC/Headphones: Mytek Liberty II, Sansui CA-F1, Sansui B-2301, Sennheiser HD800, Kef R3

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