Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems DSPC influence on highres/apodizing sources

Greetings fellow Meridan fans. Now that the Firmware dust have settled and our impressions of the new firmwares start to "firm up" I take the oppurtunity to discuss the DSPC firmware of today and generations (7 years) back.

I had this nagging feeling that I could not wrestle Trifield to the quality I had before even though I set the exact same parameters (width 1.0, Depth +1). I didn't think more of it for a while just continued to enjoy movies and music but not music to the same level as before. To me the sound before was more delicate in the midrange, more magic if you will.

So I took the time to actually upload the older c00044.mfu for the DSPC. Why this version you ask, the reason is that Trifield was never broken here. For my experiment I wanted to atleast keep that which we have fought for, for 3 years.

I run everything via HDMI sources and that means my HD621 is doing all the upsampling work with apodizing, I guess it would be the same if I had an upsampling 808.x or 800 or G series M DVD player.

Now everything else is upgraded to the latest and greatest firmware. What I experienced next could be described as an epiphany. You know when you hear the 808.x for the first time directly into a DSP8000 pair of speakers and you ask yourself, how come it sounds so incredibly good?! Well it is an awesome CD/Network player and superb speakers but also there is no processing in between, just a straight transparent runway of music signal from source to speakers.

Going through the DSPC collection of firmware provided an interesting perspective. The c00044.mfu has a scale and a soundstage space that doesn't end. When someone talks directly into the mic you hear just that with every ambience around that performer/artist. When someone sneaks up in a movie the micro details and queues are just there very very small and then BAM you are startled. The bass is furious and deep and clear. Highs are pronounced and not smoothed over you hear what is there with no blanket. I would say this version is the most 'Direct' DSPC version released to this date.

As you go on through the years the highs are more smooth, the bass is there but not abysslike. The surroundspeakers are not suspended like the original 861v4 DSPC firmware (c00044.mfu).

Have any of the M veterans done these observations as well? I take it smoothed highs can appeal to a broad market but is the cost in lost ambience and microdetails worth it?

Hi Crion,
Greetings to you.

An interesting hypothesis.

I have also not yet quite settled on a config with the latest Trifield. I was previously using a fixed version of Trifield in the v6 but with +3dB. I had reached a seamless presentation.

Where I perhaps differ is that I haven't critiqued the Sq and found smoothed results as you noted. Maybe the 8k firmware makes it harder to pinpoint where the differences come from. The highs in Trifield are more smoothed than direct but I had put that down to -3dB in Trifield compared to direct.

I guess you make a bold assumption that all c-codes are interchangeable. We know that M constructs it in a modular fashion so it could be the case.

Did you just select the specific c-codes for upload? Any messages when you did so?

I may get some time to play over the Xmas break.

Well, now that you let the cat out of the bag I guess we can chat about this

Ronomy, Erwin (EvdBerg now banned) and I have been discussing this off line (worried about threads being deleted for going outside "warranty" zones).

Ron, Erwin and I have all been running C000044 (from 861V3) for the same exact reasons you describe.

For the record it also runs on a 568.2mm (With 2.5 Beta running)

The jury is still out on my opinion. But at first demo it never sounded this "3D" EVER !! But it might be Placebo effect. But your the 4th person I know that has said "Wow".

By the way you do not lose Apodizing doing this.

If you load this, be sure to power down and power up after your done. Not sure it's required but it won't hurt.

After all this waiting, I'm not using any of the new Meridian firmware.

If I was using a combination of D8K fronts with a D7K2HC, then my settings Starting point would be

Width...........1.4

Depth...........+1.5 to +2.0 (assuming the Centre was physically equi-distant from the listening position.......I would try increasing the Depth even more if it was actually Closer than the Front L&R.....which is the case in many systems)

This is very concerning...

That's interesting Ronnie.

After much toing and froing I settled for Width 1.5 and Depth 2.0 in my system. I like the sound but I have to say the highs in Trifield are not as precise compared to Direct. I put it down to the 3dB effect, as I was using the +3db config tweak before the new firmware was loaded.

Regards,
Carl

And if 6000s with 5500 vertical center, fronts 9ft apart tweeter to tweeter all 12 ft to listening position. 3 ft off rear and side wall room 16.5x30-32 ft. Ceiling 8.5 ft sloping to 12ft?

Thanks Ronnie, I'll give the Trifield settings more playtime @Xmas time. I was just trying to find my starting point and I found it to be DSPC that affected the quality and sound-signature off all DSP modes through and through.

Hi Crion
I know that we are talking about two different things.....but I was prompted to post when I saw that you were using a Width of only 1.0

Having compared an 861v6 versus a 568 back in Jan.......both in Trifield........it was immediately obvious that a setting of 1.0 on the 568 was more like 0.7ish on the 861v6.........i.e. a much narrower soundfield was produced

In other words, I found that if I was running a Width of 1.1 on the 568, then I needed about 1.3 to 1.4 to approximate the "Width" on the 861v6

And this was all with Identical Vertical DSP's.........which is a VERY important.......and not discussed enough point when it comes to Trifield, and more importantly, what Meridian test with

Comparing an 861v4 (Width of 1.0 pre Fix) with an 861v6 also showed that a higher Width setting was required on the 861v6 and now the new Firmware

My comments on Depth would be similar, in that an extra Tick or Two was required to duplicate what was there before

As regards the main thrust to your thread, my preference has been to run Cabled Direct from the Player to the Front Pair for about 6 years now

I probably ran 70% Cable Direct versus 30% Trifield.........all depending on Music Type

The 861v6 helped to change that ratio a little more towards Trifield......and the new Firmware has helped move the Dial even more

I've also experimented with some of the things you mention on the 861v6, but I've yet to really try it in combination with the New Firmware.........so I have no comments to add as yet

I've also been running C000044 (direct and Trifield) for a few week comparing to latest C000055 several days at a time with each (adding the +3dB tweak with C000044). Currently my preference is C000044 +3dB tweak with a version of the minimum phase filter.

Avii

568 with non beta firmware I assume?

I agree that if you don't have 3 identical (orientation and height too) front speakers, you will gain performance with width set above 1.0