Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems How many Meridian users have switched to Trinnov

I got involved with Trinnov by a demo and was impressed about the audio quality with Trinnov’s sound corrections.

From that point on I tried to get that sounds into my audio chain.

Currently the Altitude is out of my budget - maybe it will come with I don't know, as there are no signs for that.

I have bought then the Trinnov Amethyst, 4 channels and Roon Ready streaming and much more features.
Finally it is integrated in that way for music streaming what my mainly source is:

All sources/zones in one room, so I can choose from which source I want listen.

1) Traditional audio chain(L/R only):
218 feed with SL out put the 861 and the 861v6 SL output feed the AES/XLR inputs from the Trinnov.
The Trinnov AES/XLR-output feed the L and R DSP8k.2.

So i have now three network sources (218, ID40, Amethyst) to listen and the Trinnov sound correction is always aktive in the chain.

If i want to listen to Trifield, then i stream either from the 218 or ID40 and choose a "DSP-preset" on the 861 like "music".

In that way the Trinnov get also a center channel signal and correct that before the signal go to center DSP.

The remaining channels (sides/rears) are done with the 861, BUT are not useable for that reason:

The processing for the sound correction takes (in my case as i make a lot of processing of the three channels) about 40-50 ms, and so the mains are delayed in respect to the surrounds.The surrounds delayed as a standard about 20-25ms, so the remaining delay is about 20-25ms but with the wrong sign-actually they are ahead!

As the sound improvement with the Trinnov was so good, I listen for a while with no surrounds at all (disconnected). As that disturbs my technical thinking... I installed a 568.2 between the Trinnovs main output(L/R) and thats feed the 568.2. The 568 then generate all surround channels and i edit the configfile in that way that I have now the correct delay in reference to the Trinnovs sound-corrected output. Also when the delay changes in the Trinnov when i choose other settings,the surrounds are still aligned to the surrounds.

Soundwise i choose now to listen in Stereo only with Trinnovs streaming as it still a preferable sound to me even when only two speakers are active. All other choices including DSP-presets sound different(should be) in a way that that isn't a bad sound,its still a very good sound, but the placement of the artists in the room and the transparent detail/resolution of tones WITHOUT loose the wholeover-music or "getting on my nerves"is (much) better. Its like that the musicians are really present in the room and the instruments are breathing not just playing.

The other setups/sources/listening modes with Meridian are more "soft,sweet,beautiful" but not the truth, but when you listen to it,you love it as it so sweet,so soft,so beautiful. You want to away, but when you do it, you recognize the difference and now you don't want to go away with that sound.Its very simply say more live,more truth, but still you can listen to it for hours and you think that just minutes as the time fly away.

As i have 7 speakers in my room and mainly listen only to two speakers, iam still thinking of the Altitude IF the DSP-presets from DolbyAtmos are so good that more speakers are sound better as iam used with Meridian DSP-presets since 25 years.
But as all of my music listening possibilities are sounds very good, iam nearly relaxed and there is no must or hunting for that.

Why don’t Meridian choose to use the Trinnovs sound correction AND streaming capability?

All of that is "just" for stereo or DSP-presets music, Liam not speaking of movies as that is not my interest.

No, I’ve always had an analogue setup and the processor was the only change.

This.

I think a lot of people would be happy with a v8.2 at this stage just to bring the basic overall SQ in line with the rest of the 800 series endpoints.

I certainly wouldn’t have hesitated over the choice, as I am currently.

Interestingly, Trinnov have announced a new free Mac OS app to replace VNC into a Trinnov processor and allow settings and calibration changes with the built-in system.

Something else Meridian never managed to do for their users.

M

Just got the email about the Trinnov App for iOS. Can't wait to try it.

Having demoed 861v8 into a full multichannel setup again yesterday (thanks Rick!) I'd like to play this question another way around -

Who is still waiting for/would love Meridian to update the 861 to v9?

From my own perspective, every time I listen to one in a full multichannel setup, my primary interest in 861 is not movie soundtracks (although this is very good of course), it's the proprietary Meridian processing of 2-channel material into e.g., Trifield, Music, Stereo and Super DSPs. It depends on how the material is recorded as to which of these sound best, but on the right recording they can sound really spectacular, in some cases better than 2-channel direct.

However, I've chosen, for the moment, to carry on with 818v3 simply and only because of the uncertainty/timescale of a 861v9 upgrade, because where there used to be parity in basic sound quality between the 808/818 and 861 of a given generation, the basic SQ of 861v8 is now not at the level of 818v3808.6, which I feel was a particularly significant upgrade.

To be clear, I don't want to conflate this with MQA or Atmos, etc. My thoughts on SQ here are quite apart from MQA source material, I'm talking SQ with all sources, and the demo was carried out with all red-book material, not MQA. Movie/TV soundtracks were listened to in 5.1.

So, how many would like Meridian to upgrade the v8 to v9, not necessarily adding anything apart from the latest low-jitter architecture and input cards, etc. to at least bring parity to the basic SQ and match the loveliness of the 818v3/808.6?

I am sure Meridian of the past (and possibly of the present) could improve the SQ of the 861v8 but to what end?

The multichannel market would surely baulk at any SSP without the support for the latest and greatest cinema-oriented sound codecs. Multi-channel music (in the discrete sense rather than Trifield, etc.) has never taken off as a desirable medium despite the efforts of the DVD-A and SACD designers and supporters.

So an 861v9 would not really offer a compelling USP over an 861v8 except for those who have already invested in the 861v8 and are prepared to pay for the upgrade - thus I cannot see it generating new sales of new kit. At that point the case for MQA on all (or at least two) channels could be made but you quite reasonably exclude it from your question.

The apparent end of development of the 861 series at v8 and the reported disparity in SQ compared with the 818v3 are what stop me buying a s/h 861v8. I have persuaded myself to be content with a G68 while considering how best to integrate it with an 818v3. Movie soundtracks are (IMHO) not about audio fidelity but instead are about dynamic range, impact and positioning. Do we believe that an 861v8/all DSP system is significantly better at those things than a lesser Meridian SSP? An analogue speaker system would I expect be a different matter.

Of course I would like Meridian to bring a v9 upgrade because it would show commitment to the legacy ethos of the brand and loyalty to customers as well as, no doubt, delivering great SQ. The price could be challenging as it would involve new A/D cards on the input, new processing cards and software and optionally new D/A cards for analogue speakers. That together sounds like £3,000+ but if I was already in an 861v8 place it would be acceptable. But the price of a new 861v9 would then presumably approach Trinnov territory without the Trinnov features?

Interesting question 3dit0r - thanks for making me think.

Because it would sound better with every input and codec it currently supports and satisfy those who need it to be on a par with their 2-channel endpoints like 818v3/808.6.

Some of them. Some will never want beyond 5.1/7.1. DTS-MA and Dolby TrueHD are still state of the art in terms of actual audio quality.

This is true, although I suspect it might have been a media/marketing thing. Now we have streaming, and Bob Stuart has hinted before that MQA might support multichannel at some point...

I think it would appeal to both existing and potential new owners - better SQ can only be a good thing in a competitive market? I only exclude MQA as a necessity, not as something potentially desirable - I think it should be an easy upgrade for it to inherit the same basic SQ while MQA implementation might take more time - perhaps an 861v8.2, then?

I think also, in general, it would always have been possible to make the same arguments against upgrades for sound quality alone, yet that is what Meridian did with 861 and with 2-channel endpoints for years, decades, where no new codecs or features were added, 'only' basic SQ was improved. Most of the audiophile industry 'upgrades' components to newer versions continuously, adding 'nothing more' than better SQ.

I think this might be a common occurrence, and it was the same for me currently, until we hear something about v9. This means Meridian are losing potential 861 sales due to uncertainty/disparity, hence my original question.

In my experience, Meridian processors and all DSPs are the most dynamic systems I've heard, so I would say yes, they're better at this.

Generally in the past, upgrades have depended on what cards you have, so it's hard to say with an 861. The basics would probably be around £2500 with additional cards extra if they changed them. Usually, price on newer units did not change, so I wouldn't see it approaching Trinnov territory at all.

No worries!

Am I right in saying that the above still does not offer any form of measurement-based room correction\EQ? If so, that is THE area I believe M should address as a priority for their two-channel components. (IMHO, jitter in their systems is already way below audible levels.)

Multichannel content aside, it's diverse RC capabilities of the Trinnov that have impressed me most and these offer major benefits for both treated and untreated rooms.

Yes, you’re correct, no Meridian 2-channel endpoints with RC yet. Huge omission and one I’ve lobbied Meridian about over the years for inclusion on 818. Meridian’s argument used to be if you wanted RC you wanted an 861, but again that’s when there was parity in SQ between 2 and multichannel units, so it’s not really a valid argument any more.

Interesting thread with some very well reasoned arguments, I guess the big question is how many 861v8’s are Meridian selling? As we will never have an answer to that, one question we may be able to ask is:

How many HH have purchased a NEW 861v8 in the last 12 months?

This may provide some insight into the likelihood of 861v8 upgrades, I side with Gianni on this.

While this may give you a small sample of 861v8 purchases, I bet the vast majority of new 861 purchasers are not members of this forum. At one time, 861 sales in the US were probably in the area of a hundred or so a year. I would suspect that number has declined somewhat in recent years.