Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems DSP5200 or more B&W?

Theory is all very well, but I go by my ears. They were auditioned side by side in my own living room for a whole weekend.

The differences were not subtle, nor a matter of taste. Many types of music sounded better on the 5200s but female vocals, or large scale choral classical were not among them.

I do miss the bass now the 5200s have gone back.

I want the best of both. Since I using a G57 I do not think amplification is the reason for the difference. G57 and DSP5200 amps are both derived from DSP8000 amps.

For $11000 the treble performance of the DSP5200 is not up to snuff. Nuff said. The 804s I have were $4000 - with the amp $7600.

Sanjay

Bernie,

Do you work in Marketing?

Sanjay,

I strongly encourage you to check out the Gallo Acoustics Reference 3 Speakers ( http://www.roundsound.com/ref3.html ). See my post above. I think that you will really like them, and they're cheap, too ($2600/pair)!

Damon

Damon, these look awesome, how high are they compared to DSP 5000's etc ?

Out of interest what is the matching centre speaker. ?

I must agree with the DSP comments, i got fed up with cables and isolation and power etc. The DSPs got rid of all that upgraditis, but the reference 3 seems to be artwork.

thanks for sharing, if they are 2500 pounds in the UK then perhaps they may not be as much of a catch, 2500 dollars, now that might be a problem.

Sanjay,

I'm very curious what you think of the new N803D. I have the older N803's and I'm very satisfied wth the bass and run with no sub.

Room is not that large.

But I do agree with the mention of power. Put at least 250 watts of good oooph behind each large B&W speaker or you will not get the bass.

803's look great too. Not overdone and not a box.

Oh my god are those Gallo Reference 3's ugly. My wife would break down in tears if I brought those home.

I think B&W 802 and 801's are ugly too.



[This message has been edited by George Mills (edited 05-01-2005).]

After reading this thread. I decided to stroll on past the B&W web site. Holly crap do that have a wide range of speakers now.

DSP Subwoofers with room correction and SPDIF input.
Switchable MonoPole/Dipole Surrounds with 12 trigger to switch mode.

There was also an interesting note on the 803 line stating that it is for the customer looking for the less "Techie" look. They also squeezed another driver in there to get the bass up a notch.

I think I just caught the upgrade bug.


[This message has been edited by George Mills (edited 05-03-2005).]

I've been reading this thread with interest, and here are my observations / thoughts so far, related to my own experiences.

I spent a long time trying to decide which speakers to buy for my home. My first problem was that I couldn't listen to everything I wanted to in one place. Eventually I had to visit 3 different dealers to audition everything that I wanted to hear. My thinking was that as I planned to invest a sizeable sum of money I wanted to be sure I'd made the right choice.

Early on in the process, I ruled out the DSP systems. I just didn't rate the sound of the 5ks, and 5500s are just too big for my listening area. So, I auditioned a massive range, including B&W Nautilus 804 & 803, Wilson Benesch Act, Verity Audio, Sonus Faber, Martin Logan & Dynaudio.

In each case, I took my own amplification along to the dealer to drive the speakers with. It's worth the effort, 'cause many speakers will sound radically different depending on the amplification.

This process took me around 6 weeks of auditions, but the end result was worth it.

Ultimately I'd say to anyone looking for speakers - take your time and listen to as many as you can. There's a lot of variation out there, and you should trust what your ears tell you!!

Cheers,

David

So what did you finally decide on.

By the way I think rooms make a bigger difference than amps on speakers.

Finally bought the Martin Logans. With the exception of Wilson Benesch, the MLs blew everything else away in terms of sheer sound quality and transparency. Wilson Benesch came in close second, but the extra cost of WBs is quite staggering (�9k for WB Act vs �3.5k for MLs that to my ears sounded better!)

Rooms certainly make a difference, but the ML speakers are *very* revealing of any weakness in the chain, so it's vital to run a decent amplifier with them. I'm currently running Meridian amplification, but I'm thinking of changing to Bel Canto power, and sticking with Meridian pre.

Cheers,

David

On another thread GarethHoward posted 05-03-2005 04:35 AM
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Hi Recruit
I've spoken to Meridian and the tech told me that the G91 WILL NOT upsample CD used as a surround system with DSP speakers. Likewise for DVD and only upsamples analogue inputs into it.
I tried it as a digital out only and it does upsample CD's so it must use it's power doing the surround thing which disables the upsampling.
So it seems thats not broke then, just the other issues I seem to have must be software.

Cheers

[This message has been edited by garethhoward (edited 05-03-2005).
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This was the mode in which I auditioned the DSP5200s. My G91 was set to Type 6 to use it as a surround processor to generate Trifield. I was mostly playing CDs though also played some DVDAs including some 96kHz/24bit. Thse sounded good but the available selection didn't include the female vocals tat highlighted the treble issues on CD playback so I can't confirm this is definitely an upsampling issue.

When I compared to the B&W speakers the G91 was in Type 0 used as a 2 channel analog preamp with upsampling delivered to the analog outputs.

This could explain some of the lack of treble smoothness when listening to the DSP5200s. But a big part of the rationale for G91 + DSP5200 would be to avoid the costly G68 purchase. If this is necessary to get CD upsampling and smooth the treble, then the value equation changes considerably, away from DSP speakers. You can no longer count the G68 cost saving in the favour of the DSP speaker option.

I did not listen much in Type 1 (stereo digital speakers only) where upsampling might have been active, as reconfiguring the G91 and speakers was so frustrating and unrepeatable. Rather I used the DSP modes in Type 6 to switch from Trifield to Stereo.

Also the DSP5200 speakers were brand new, not sure if there is a break in benefit.

I am working on getting an N803D audition and will report back with findings here in a few weeks.

Sanjay

(No Marketing in my future, or current carreer. Rather blah actually).


I've Read with interest this lengthy string, and (as always) found many good angles.

One item sticks out... The question of power.

My Prior B & W's were powered by 5 series amps 2 each, but I auditioned G Amps as well as Krell, and found no issues with bass response in my room. Each are very solid. implementing huge Torroids, and clean Struggle free Low end.
I did find that B & W boasted a much higher than actual efficiency and that they are in fact hard to drive, due to complex crossover circuit paths... but not that hard. You should get reasonable bass in an average room.


If you find anything less, you may wish to have your binding post/s checked and or the Crossover on you speakers tested. A tech told me that corrosion on the input leads, or bad Caps in the crossover, may unfairly punish your B & W's bass response.

The room may indeed have more to say about the raw bass power your ears measure.

My experience is that if with 200 w Class A rated Amps you cannot get great bass from your B & W's, then you are a candidate for DSP's simply because you need to make several adjustments to sound within your room, These adjustments are inherent to DSP's.

Short of a DSP you will need to revisit the room issues plaguing your speaker output. and Perhaps requires Room Correction with passives.

-Bernie

Sanjay

What Soft Version is your G91 operating?

I missed two points on you last post.

1. Switching between types on the G91 should be very simple -- just turn it off, press more, and select type. Similarly the Speakers can be changed with the MSR remote holding the number key and turning speaker on. L & R master and slave simply press play.

2. In the type 1, 0 and 6 configuration/s, you were comparing apples to bananas, because in Analogue Mode, you were listening at Quad Speed 176.4 for CD's, and Conversely in Your (DSP Type 6) set-up you were listening at 44.1.

This should account for all or most of your claimed high freq resolution and Texture shortfalls.

As proof you may wish to sample the room frequncies with a meter, and compare them.

The High Frequencies were there, but the benefit of Precious upsampling was making your B & W's sound shinier, while your DSP's were playing without.

So when you next demo; you may wish to go about this differently

Cheers

Bernie