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Joined: Mar 2012
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Hitchhiker
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Thanks Russ

Yes running 8.1 still a distinct difference in SQ.

There is a lot less bass with Stereo engaged and I have the 861 setup as just 2 channel at the moment i.e only 2 speakers in Mconfig

Everything goes soft squidgy and blurred by comparison

Clear as day.

However I have not set the correct distance yet. I will do that when setting up the full AV.


861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
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Pan-dimensional being
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I notice your speakers are rated down to 43Hz plus/minus 3db. Where do you have the crossover set for stereo, integrated with the sub?


James
NC1: 861v8, ID41, 218, 251(to outdoors), DSP8000SEUG, 7200SEC, DSP520 rears, Apple TV, DirecTV, Oppo BD103, QNAP251, Roon
NC2-M7005, Triad Silver Speakers,Acurus Amps

FL1: 861v4, ID40, 218, MS200, DSP8000SEs, DSP7200SEC, DSP5000s, DirecTv, AppleTv, OppoBD103, QNAP469, Roon
FL2: Marantz 7005, 251, M60s,60C,33s, Oppo BDP-93,MS200, Roon
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Hitchhiker
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There are no subs presently in Mconfig just the 2 main speakers set to large.

Measured with REW there is loads of bass to where the speakers drop off.

I am comparing apples with apples here Direct loads of bass Stereo much less bass and worse sound overall.

The only difference is the distance is set too short as I have moved the MLP back about 3 feet into a better spot.

I know this makes a difference so will test again when set properly.


861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
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Pan-dimensional being
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Running your mains full range in Stereo should sound exactly as Direct sounds if settings are identical.

Last edited by Mtns; 2016-07-31 20:45. Reason: Correction to respond to actual facts.

James
NC1: 861v8, ID41, 218, 251(to outdoors), DSP8000SEUG, 7200SEC, DSP520 rears, Apple TV, DirecTV, Oppo BD103, QNAP251, Roon
NC2-M7005, Triad Silver Speakers,Acurus Amps

FL1: 861v4, ID40, 218, MS200, DSP8000SEs, DSP7200SEC, DSP5000s, DirecTv, AppleTv, OppoBD103, QNAP469, Roon
FL2: Marantz 7005, 251, M60s,60C,33s, Oppo BDP-93,MS200, Roon
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Hitchhiker
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How can the settings be different?

The only difference I can think of will be the distance setting I would guess direct bypasses any delay settings like that.


861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 958
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Pan-dimensional being
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According to Marc Koval, ex Meridian USA senior technical guy for 20+ years and currently a dealer, without subwoofer support, stereo equals Direct. That's when I learned my front sub supported only the center channel.


James
NC1: 861v8, ID41, 218, 251(to outdoors), DSP8000SEUG, 7200SEC, DSP520 rears, Apple TV, DirecTV, Oppo BD103, QNAP251, Roon
NC2-M7005, Triad Silver Speakers,Acurus Amps

FL1: 861v4, ID40, 218, MS200, DSP8000SEs, DSP7200SEC, DSP5000s, DirecTv, AppleTv, OppoBD103, QNAP469, Roon
FL2: Marantz 7005, 251, M60s,60C,33s, Oppo BDP-93,MS200, Roon
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 338
Hitchhiker
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Fair enough, that is taken on board - However I am only saying it how it is for me at the moment - the difference I am hearing is not small

So much so I am considering never using Stereo again and will live without 45hz and below. I would rather sacrifice the lowest octaves to maintain the rest of what I have been hearing with direct engaged.



861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
Joined: May 2001
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Hooloovoo
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Have you checked the setting for whether subwoofers are active in music and/or AV DSP modes?

See Page 71 of this manual.


In the spirit of Spinaltap, I would like to confirm that I am not involved in the corrupt theft of a global sport.
Joined: Mar 2012
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Hitchhiker
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Firmware

[Linked Image from i347.photobucket.com]

MConfig
No subs used

[Linked Image from i347.photobucket.com]


861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
Joined: Feb 2010
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Pan-dimensional being
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I am not surprised you like it better all direct. 43 Hz is plenty low for a vast majority of music. A sub not properly dialed in, so as to disappear can be a detractor. Even with room correction it can be a challenge. Before Meridian I had(still do) Vandersteen Modsl 2s. Time aligned front open baffles. Covered with a sock like M2s but shaped like a box. They are flat to 35. Never could get a sub to integrate.


James
NC1: 861v8, ID41, 218, 251(to outdoors), DSP8000SEUG, 7200SEC, DSP520 rears, Apple TV, DirecTV, Oppo BD103, QNAP251, Roon
NC2-M7005, Triad Silver Speakers,Acurus Amps

FL1: 861v4, ID40, 218, MS200, DSP8000SEs, DSP7200SEC, DSP5000s, DirecTv, AppleTv, OppoBD103, QNAP469, Roon
FL2: Marantz 7005, 251, M60s,60C,33s, Oppo BDP-93,MS200, Roon
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 338
Hitchhiker
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It's nothing to do with sub integration - I could integrate a sub into this system perfectly from any frequency from 150Hz down.

I have the skill to do it seamlessly and that would normally be my preferred option and has been my setup method for years.

However I am talking about the difference between Direct and Stereo with the system as it is now - purely stereo speakers and set to large.


861v4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST
KEF Reference 3 and 2c, 2 X SVS SB13 ULTRA
Audio PC: JPLay, LPSU, JCAT, PPA Studio
Cables XLO Limited, Unlimited Edition and Signature
Sony VW500 Isotek Titan, DIY Mains and Clean Signal Earth Solution
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 958
Likes: 5
Pan-dimensional being
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There should be none. Isn't the question why the Stereo signal is not the as as Direct in your use case?

It must be down to a configuration difference?


James
NC1: 861v8, ID41, 218, 251(to outdoors), DSP8000SEUG, 7200SEC, DSP520 rears, Apple TV, DirecTV, Oppo BD103, QNAP251, Roon
NC2-M7005, Triad Silver Speakers,Acurus Amps

FL1: 861v4, ID40, 218, MS200, DSP8000SEs, DSP7200SEC, DSP5000s, DirecTv, AppleTv, OppoBD103, QNAP469, Roon
FL2: Marantz 7005, 251, M60s,60C,33s, Oppo BDP-93,MS200, Roon
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