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#217606 2014-07-25 18:13
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Pan-dimensional being
Pan-dimensional being
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Hi,

I'm introducing an HD621 into a system with a G65 and a Panasonic Plasma TV (TH50PZ850U). Connection to G65 is via MMHR and comm. I get sound but no picture. I think it is a handshake issue but when I've seen that problem before there is some flickering of the screen before it goes black. In this case I see nothing at all on the screen. The sources are TIVO and Oppo. This set up was working with a simple HDMI switch so I know (or think) the cables are not the problem.

I tested the HD621 with a different Panasonic Plasma (newer) in another room and it worked. For the test, I ran an Oppo into the HD621 and then connected the HD621 out directly to the plasma. So the HD621 was not connected to a processor.

I tried the same "stand-alone" test with the plasma where I want to install the HD621 and it did not pass video. So it seems there is some sort of problem between the HD621 and this particular plasma.

My dealer suggested that I try a different HDMI input on the TV which I have not done because the TV is mounted on the wall and the inputs are not reachable without taking the damn thing off the wall. Will do if there is no other option.

I wonder if I had a video processor or some other device in the chain between the HD621 and the TV would the problem still arise. In other words, does the device only need to handshake with the units immediately before and after? I think it probably has to do a proper handshake with every device in the chain. At one point I had a Radiance before this TV (but no HD621) and had no problems which is why I was thinking of sorting this by putting the HD621 out of direct connection with the TV.

Anyone had or heard of a problem like this?

Suggestions?

Thanks.


MD600(2x2TB); iPad Pro
LR. 818v3, 8000SE
HT. 861v8+ID41,HD621; BW 2x802D,HTM1D,4x804S;SVS sub; Mac 5 MC501s; RGP 600Pro, JVC X950; Radiance Pro; Oppo 203
FR. G65, DSP3200-3300 DSW, HD621; Mac MC152; Oppo 103, PDP TCP65VT60, Radiance 2124; RGP1200C
4. G65, DSP3200-3300,HD621; OPPO 83, Radiance XE PDP
5. 818v3; Prime HP Amp; HD800
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
Senior Shouting Officer
Senior Shouting Officer
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
I had a similar problem with my HD621 and a Pioneer LCD TV. It may have been a combination of the cable (10m) and TV spec. I solved it by putting a HDMI booster between the HD621 and the TV. ( This one in my case) ). Strangely it worked better at the HD621 end of the chain.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, Vero 4k, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Pan-dimensional being
Pan-dimensional being
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Thanks Cliff. Maybe I will try that.

I wish, however, I knew more why this sort of problem might arise. Is it that the HD621 is more fussy than the Radiance I had in the chain or the other devices?


MD600(2x2TB); iPad Pro
LR. 818v3, 8000SE
HT. 861v8+ID41,HD621; BW 2x802D,HTM1D,4x804S;SVS sub; Mac 5 MC501s; RGP 600Pro, JVC X950; Radiance Pro; Oppo 203
FR. G65, DSP3200-3300 DSW, HD621; Mac MC152; Oppo 103, PDP TCP65VT60, Radiance 2124; RGP1200C
4. G65, DSP3200-3300,HD621; OPPO 83, Radiance XE PDP
5. 818v3; Prime HP Amp; HD800
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
Senior Shouting Officer
Senior Shouting Officer
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
I've given up trying to understand HDMI handskaking issues. Have you tried a direct connection between your TV and e.g. your Oppo recently to rule out the possoblity of a lose HDMI connection at the TV end?


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, Vero 4k, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Pan-dimensional being
Pan-dimensional being
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I didn't try that but I had an HDMI switch in the chain before I tried to insert the HD621 and there were no problems with the video.


MD600(2x2TB); iPad Pro
LR. 818v3, 8000SE
HT. 861v8+ID41,HD621; BW 2x802D,HTM1D,4x804S;SVS sub; Mac 5 MC501s; RGP 600Pro, JVC X950; Radiance Pro; Oppo 203
FR. G65, DSP3200-3300 DSW, HD621; Mac MC152; Oppo 103, PDP TCP65VT60, Radiance 2124; RGP1200C
4. G65, DSP3200-3300,HD621; OPPO 83, Radiance XE PDP
5. 818v3; Prime HP Amp; HD800
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
Senior Shouting Officer
Senior Shouting Officer
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
Fair enough. As a matter of interest did you try it with your HDMI switch between the HD621 and the TV? Switches can sometimes act as boosters.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, Vero 4k, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Pan-dimensional being
Pan-dimensional being
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You know I was just thinking that and, sad to say blush , I don't remember if I tried putting the switch after the HD621. I guess it is worth a try.

EDIT.
Actually maybe the best would be to put the switch before the HD621 in which case I then would not have to connect the HD621 to the TV. I could just run HDMI into the HD621 but not out. Hmmm. I bet that will work.

Last edited by Jack D; 2014-07-25 19:24.

MD600(2x2TB); iPad Pro
LR. 818v3, 8000SE
HT. 861v8+ID41,HD621; BW 2x802D,HTM1D,4x804S;SVS sub; Mac 5 MC501s; RGP 600Pro, JVC X950; Radiance Pro; Oppo 203
FR. G65, DSP3200-3300 DSW, HD621; Mac MC152; Oppo 103, PDP TCP65VT60, Radiance 2124; RGP1200C
4. G65, DSP3200-3300,HD621; OPPO 83, Radiance XE PDP
5. 818v3; Prime HP Amp; HD800
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 702
Likes: 13
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Paranoid android
Paranoid android
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 702
Likes: 13
I believe that there was a thread somewhat recently discussing a similar problem, where the length of HDMI cable was an issue (I thought it was in this thread, but can't find it with a quick scan).

Somewhat counterintuitively, the HDMI cable has to be longer than some minimum. I think it had something to do with error correction and return timing (fuzzy memory). Anyhow, an easy test would be to put a longer HDMI cable between Oppo/TIVO and see if it makes a difference.


Cheers, Ian

1: Roon on Mac Studio, G-Drive 10TB, 818v3, 7200.2, UHD722, LG 77G4
2. 808.6, 8kSE
3. 218, 3200's
4: Rivian R1T - 18 speaker 1200W Elevation by Meridian premium sound system
5. G68ADV (croaked), G98DH (also croaked), [HD621, Syles SL-S/PDIF, MD600 (2*4TB), QNAP 469L (4*3TB), MS200], Ayre MX-R Twenties, TBD
ISB #217621 2014-07-25 19:34
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,061
Pan-dimensional being
Pan-dimensional being
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Ian,
I did a search before posting but didn't find anything that seemed relevant. Maybe I just didn't put in the correct key words.

Anyway, I still go back to the question of why would the exact cable set up work without the HD621 but not with it? It seems it must be something fussy about the HD621.
thanks.


MD600(2x2TB); iPad Pro
LR. 818v3, 8000SE
HT. 861v8+ID41,HD621; BW 2x802D,HTM1D,4x804S;SVS sub; Mac 5 MC501s; RGP 600Pro, JVC X950; Radiance Pro; Oppo 203
FR. G65, DSP3200-3300 DSW, HD621; Mac MC152; Oppo 103, PDP TCP65VT60, Radiance 2124; RGP1200C
4. G65, DSP3200-3300,HD621; OPPO 83, Radiance XE PDP
5. 818v3; Prime HP Amp; HD800
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
Senior Shouting Officer
Senior Shouting Officer
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,492
I've come to the conclusion that there must be significant differences between boxes with respect to their tolerance to HDMI signal strength, particularly with respect to the handshaking aspects of the connection.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, Vero 4k, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 537
Likes: 2
Paranoid android
Paranoid android
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 537
Likes: 2
I run a 50ft HDMI cable between the HD621 and a Sony ruby projector, and have never had a problem. The cable has serious shielding.

I'm wondering whether swapping cables, just as an experiment, might be worth a try.


Living room: 818v3, Parasound A23+, Maggie 1.6
A/V room: 861v8, DSP7200SE L/R/C, 4x DSP320 surrounds, ID41 + Roon, UHD722, Prime+PS
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 19
Harmless
Harmless
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Posts: 19
How does an HD621 handle EDID? I've seen that cause all kinds of problems with HDMI, most of which initially look like cabling issues. This post on The Poor Audiophile documents one reported solution, "The fix for HDMI woes", but I haven't tried it.

Cheers,
Simon


Roon Nucleus, Raspberry Pi + HifiBerry DIGI+ Pro, DSP3100.
Also another Raspberry Pi running Roon extensions with a Griffin PowerMate controller.
Unused: MC200.
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