Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion HiFi & HT Chat The Philosophy of Tweaking Equipment

Ian, That was a big bite. In general, I agree on all except the above. If you found the secret part/method on the car it is yours for the taking. Unless it's patented of course. And in the patent you are required to give up the "secret" for long term protection. This is by American patent law and patent laws vary from country to country. The developer here has one year to file a patent or his intelectual property is gone forever. The standard non-medical patent will expire in twenty years. The developer can opt to keep it secret but is at risk if others can find the non patented secret.

Regards,
Gary

Thank you Ian, as a "Numpty" I was confused but I am now confused at "A much higher level".
It seems there is a high degree of polarisation on this subject which benefits no one.
Ian your arguments are convincing.
My confusion is about the future relationship of this forum with M. I am sure the majority of members hope that communications improve (IMHO going in the right direction) and I can see that many members do not appreciate the detremental actions of others. By association with this forum we benefit hugely from the experience and knowledge of others, however if owners wish to modify equipment hardware or software/fimware this is their choice but please have due deference to other members who may not appreciate the consequences of your shared actions.
Published experiences of hardware modifications are extremely interesting. WelwynNick is addressing a real reliability issue albeit with advised SQ improvements on power supplies (never hear of a 500 series PS failure).
Independant Software/Firmware mods appear to be entirely different with a huge negative effect on the credibility of us all.
Appologies for any offence taken from the "Numpty" view.

Maybe the answer is a separate forum or similar relating to M tweaking that avoids this one offending M or those that don't agree with tweaking.

Avii

I see reference to modifying car engines and hardware mods being OK but software mods not OK.

As far as car engines go there are manufacturers of computer tools to modify engine software. Nothing ilegal there.

Erwin created a tool to let you modify your hardware. Nothing wrong with that. IMHO

I had this long post typed in and realized it didn't make much sense. It did take up a lot of screen real estate and looked like a really nifty combination of black text on a white background

The heart of the matter is that there are many here who have purchased second hand and without a factory warranty. Many don't have dealer relationships to fall back on which makes the ability to legitimately obtain the factory software difficult at best.

If Erwyn's code is a unique implementation and doesn't rely on any of Meridian's IP (I have no idea) then does Meridian have a say? I see it as no different than installing a new OS on an out of warranty computer -- nothing more nothing less.

If, on the other hand, Erwyn's implementation is not unique that's another matter entirely.

Perhaps I'm oversimplifying this, it certainly would not be the first time I've done so.

Why? Erwin created the new filter himself and boy does it sound great! You guys are missing out.

I'd like to point out that two distinctly separate issues are at risk of conflation here.

The philosophy of tweaking will have adherents and detractors, personally I think Erwin has received far too much criticism for his innovative efforts to bring us a solution which Meridian promised, and took a very long time to deliver. Great that we now have the official release, and also great that we have creative thinkers like Erwin and George Mills.

The issue of Meridian's relationship with this forum is a different matter for discussion, and it's worth remembering that the (unpopular) "Dealer only" route of contact was well established prior to Erwin's work, so let's not rewrite history to make Erwin out as the bad guy who brought the whole show down. That is simply not the case.

As an aside, I didn't sign, nor was I required to sign, a contract or disclaimer when I bought my Meridian equipment to state that I'd maintain the products in the same condition as supplied. I view it as my decision whether I modify it or not, and in whatever manner I choose. Unless we have some firm legal footing on the matter, I think this subject is one for personal opinion only, however strongly held that opinion may be.

Cheers

George

Of course Erwin's filter relies on Meridian IP - it couldn't work without it. In the same way that a CD manufacturer relies on Sony Philips IP. Don't all legitimate CD manufacturers (players and discs) have to pay a license and commit to complying with the Red Book standard to ensure quality and consistency? The question is whether what he has done is legitimate. Whether it sounds better is entirely irrelevant to its legitimacy. Whether I choose to use it is down to my view on that legitimacy.

Sorry, on re-reading my post reads as an attack on individuals' views; to clarify, it is not meant in that manner but as my contribution to the debate.

The car analogy has been raised, and I did wonder about this myself.

Isn't the case in point similar to buying an aftermarket engine-chip-box-mod-thingy? Wouldn't such remapping devices have to be derived from the existing electronic engine management code to enable them to slot in and work as they do?

Although you clearly install such engine mods at your own risk, are car manufacturers relentlessly pursuing the accessory makers for producing such devices? is there legal precedent for car manufacturers taking action against modification companies for these tuning kits?

Cheers

George

There are a gazillion DIY forums that people could use. No need to set one up.

Erwin's new filter is no different from making a hardware change or modifying your cars engine software to change the power curve across the RPM range.

If it bothers you fine don't do it.

Yes, but hardware mods depend on Meridian's IP as well. I wouldn't be able to fit another power supply if Meridian hadn't designed a controller to put it in. That design included voltage and current requirements that I reverse-engineered. I think its the whole design that is their IP. That design consists of both H/W and S/W, and I don't understand what is so precious about S/W. People that develop S/W for a living are protective of it, but what if we had a H/W designer here? Maybe even a Meridian designer? Wouldn't he also be protective about his work, and afronted if someone tried to modify it?
Agreed. He's not taking an engine, modifying it, then selling it as his own engine. He's only selling the modification. The user still has to own the orignal product.

Nick