Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Streaming MS600 Settings question

Hi Ronnie,

I think the analogue out will remain unchanged in all cases, upsampled digital feeding the DACS.

I don't think this will then be downsampled for the Direct feed.
Direct to me is as it says, the direct, native, 'raw' digital output at whatever rate the music was sampled. so 16/44 will stay at 16 bit.

(Apart from 192/176 which will be downsampled)

Rick

Thanks Rick
Any chance you can check this with Meridian??

From several historical conversations with Meridian's Bob, Rhonda and Des, my description above is what the 568, 861, and 800 & 808 Players do

i.e. ALL Internal Processing is done at the Higher Rates......the DAC's are fed with this HS Stream.......and so is the Digital Out, unless the User chooses otherwise......in which case it's down sampled at the Digital out

This also corresponds with a 568 Flow Diagram that I got from Meridian and posted here several times before

Can't imagine that they would change that Rationale on the Sooloos products??

I also think that it wouldn't make much sense to have TWO Internal Data Paths........one for Analog and another for Digital??

Hi Ronnie,

Just checked now.

You are correct, there is a single internal data path.

I am correct about the Direct digital output being 'raw' 16/44

The DACs for the analogue output are fed directly from the digital output that is influenced in resolution by the 'X1, X2 and Direct' selection.

So this has implications for analogue output users...

The X2 digital output needs to be selelcted to benefit from apodising and upsampling before this high res digital signal is fed to the DACS.
I've not tried this but it appears that the MS600 will sound at its best from its analogue outputs with the digital X2 box checked.

Not immediately obvious I'll admit.

Rick

Many thanks for the clarification Rick

Somewhat surprising on Two fronts, I'd have to say

I'll reply in more detail later when not on a phone

Again thanks for securing this information

Cheers
Ronnie

Hi Ronnie,

Right, as you were...
Apologies, Completey ignore my previous post!

I've now found out that I had this all wrong.
There are in fact two seperate internal DSP paths, one for each of the analogue and digital signals.
The Analogue DSP will always run the same as the 'x2 setting'; upsampling and apodising 16/44, allowing 88 or 96 straight through and so always feeding high resolution into the DACs.

The digital output settings of 'x1, x2 and direct' have no influence on the Analogue DSP path.

So the digital output settings won't affect the analogue performance at all.

Sorry for the confusion!

Rick

Hi Rick
Thanks again for the clarification

Obviously, I can't comment on how the MS600 (or indeed MC200) deals with Digital Streams, so the only thing I can say is that I'm surprised at the "Two Separate Internal DSP Paths" comment

Take the 568 Diagram below (which I mentioned last Friday as having being discussed at length with Bob, Rhonda and Des many years ago at this stage......and they confirmed that the same Rationale applied to the 800 and 861)

As you can see, the FIFO and Upsampling / RE happens first and then any required Processing happening on the HS Data, resulting in better audio performance

The SAME HS Data is then used to Feed BOTH the Digital and Analog Outputs, with Downsampling of the Digital Outputs if necessary

[/quote]

Hi Ronnie,

Well I've been told straight from the horse's mouth the MS600 has two seperate DSP paths, one for Analogue and one for Digital, and they can run in different modes simutaniously.

I'm pretty sure I have it right this time!

Obviously a very different architecture from 568.

Cheers,

Rick

Hi Rick
[My post below crossed with your post above.....so apologies for any contradictions]

Also consider the following direct quotes from Bob Stuart FAQ's

This also now seems to be happening with the MS600 and Sooloos Products

I've add the emphasis to the word "Downsampling"

My interpretation of this is as follows

** The User chooses "HS=No" on Meridian Products......(or possibly "x1 Output" on Sooloos products)

** Many here have expected this setting to result in the Incoming Data not being Upsampled / RE'd / Apodized AT ALL

** If that were actually the case, then Bob would not have used the term Downsampling.......as Upsampling would not have happened in the first place

** The fact that he uses the word "Downsampling".....plus the above diagram.....plus historical discussions........plus when I tested the HS=No Output from an 800 Player, it showed 24/44 PCM.........all of these lead me to believe for Meridian Products like 800 Series and G Series that

a) ONE Internal Data Path....that Feeds BOTH the Analog and Digital Outputs

b) All Data Streams are Upsampled / RE'd (& Apodized) to 24/88 at the Input stage

c) Downsampling only happens at the DIgital Output stage is the user so chooses

Hi Rick
Our posts crossed...........

I was going to finish by saying that the Meridian design appears different to the Sooloos internal design

It's surprising that they have choosen two different design rationales for what are both Music Replay devices

But like I said, I don't have any information on the Sooloos..........so your Horse's Mouth information has to take precedence obviously

Still surprising nonetheless

Cheers
Ronnie

Hi Ronnie,

Well I've had another discussion with them today, and it's certainly the case that there are two DSP paths, seperate for analogue and digital.

As it's a very new design I believe it is something to do with the inherent capabilities of the current chipsets they're using.

Cheers,

Rick

Thanks again Rick for the clarification

With the New Chipsets etc., Is it still safe to assume that the Sooloos Products (MS600 and MC200 for example) still Resolution Enhance 16bit material up to 24bit material??

i.e. that Redbook 16/44 becomes 24/88 after Upsampling / Apodizing??

Likewise, is it safe to assume that the "x2" Setting is the Optimum for

a) Meridian Processor and DSP Users.........as they can handle the 24/88 Streams

b) For Analog Speaker Users using the Sooloos DAC's

c) For non-Meridian DAC Users, whose DAC's can handle 24/88 Inputs