Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems DSP speakers? Worth it?

Yes its true, and already stated, that if you purchase the digital speakers you are now a part of the Meridian system.

But lets get something straight- on one hand we have high end gear, which includes something like the Theta, and on the other hand we have a more performance per dollar strategy. I hardly think the Casablanca is a product that can be called a great "bang for the buck". So if you are considering spending over $10k for a surround processor, youre really now getting into an inflexible position because to sell such a processor for the next big thing will cost you tremendous depreciation. The moral of the story with any big ticket purchase is: you better be sure its what you want- because once its in your house- short of a defect- its all yours.

How important is it to you to be able to switch the D-A and amps in your system? if its of prime importance then there is no good reason to go with Meridian Digital Speakers. But what if your prime reason is to get the most pleasing performance you can get right now? Will you always be chasing the bigger and better of tomorrow? Thats where the automobile analogy comes in. Whatever you get now: its outdated. Just like with computers. We all know the people who say: "I want to get a new computer, but Im waiting for prices to fall and performance to increase". They never end up getting that computer because they are always waiting. Im from the school of thought that says: do your research, make your choice and then do it. Accept the pros and cons. Now amps and speaker drivers are less so likely to become quickly outdated- but even then, improvements in manufacturing and design will mean tomorrows products cost less, are more reliable, and perform either as well or better than today. Today's Porsche Turbo seems pretty tame with its what? 425bhp because companies like BMW and Mercedes offer sedans with 400-469bhp. In a sedan!

Same thing with DVD players. Look at the poor saps who bought the 1st generation DVD players for $2k and up. No DTS. Slow load and layer changes. Maybe they cant even read CD-Rs. Now I can get a player for as little as $75- thats 26x cheaper!- and it performs so much more and better too! HAHAHA FOOLS!

No, of course not. Thats the price for being first and they knew it. Maybe the Meridian setup isnt the way of everything in the future is- but the point is- it will become outdated. And not all at once. The part that will age the quickest is the processing element (D-A, etc) and the least quick are the amps. And as it ages, I know I can make the changes- especially to the processing part. One thing you might not know is that Meridian does a lot of their processing is done in software- so you can get incrimental improvements that are downloadable without the need for actual new chips. Its only when they need more horsepower (to borrow from the cars) that they have a hardware update. For example we are about to get Dolby Prologic IIx- it will be a download and that will be that. If M goes out of business or into another business and I cant upgrade it- there will be choices that have to be made. The most simple of those choices is to keep what is there. It works today and theres no reason it wouldnt work tomorrow. We're back to my Apple IIe example. So what if Meridian ceased to exist? I would have what? A system that can playback any source we know of today and are likely to see for quite some time. Maybe Theta gets better D-A? Maybe its Wadia? Who cares? That 80's Ferrari is still a Ferrari today, and its still special, and it still performs well for what it is. In 20 years, if I never update the setup, I think I would be happy with the performance. If my buddy that Im trying to talk into building a home theater gets bigger and better than I say: great for him! Ill now be happy for 2 of us. And Ill give him some pointers on what good DVD-As to get.

I agree with you that people buy things like Ferraris for many reasons. In all honesty, I bought the 8000s for one reason: performance. They are excellent speakers! Yes they look good too- they should for the price they ask. Do some peoeple buy them for other reasons? Im sure they do. Do those Wilson speakers that go for $120k really need to look like something out of the 60s idea of the future?

As to what they cost- and this gets back to Cue03's original question- lets look what Meridian says about their product:

Now, Id say the 8000s are in the performance category with speakers costing around $20k and up. Lets break down Meridian's claims and try to make them into an apples to apples comparison. Lets talk about the drivers- all speakers have some sort of material that moves- and lets assume that Meridians are no better or worse than the others in the high end realm. Then you have the cabinet, which is very stiff- thats a good thing since you dont want the cabinet introducing sonic coloration via unwanted resonances. Again, lets just say the competition has the same thing- certainly they have that ability. Next you have the amplifiers. According to Meridian, there are 5 amps at 100watts each= 500 watts per speaker. I believe each pair of woofers gets 1 amp, thats 300 watts to the woofers, and then there are seperate amps for the midrange and tweeter. Getting the sound there are 4 digital converters and crossovers. I dont know exactly where the 4th crossover would go- I see the need for 3 crossovers- but lets just add that to the mix. You then have some minor room correction built into the speaker and the ability to carry IR signals back to the surround processor whereever it may be.

So it seems to me the areas of differentiation are the in speaker amplification, digital crossover, d-a, room correction and IR repeating inside the speaker.

Lets try to replicate the same thing with analog speakers and see what we get.

1 pair DSP8000s= $45k. One pair of brand X high end speakers =$20k. We will assume new MSRP since discounts may be had on either and I would imagine the dealers for both dont discount too heavily.

we will need 5 amplifiers. How about something nice like Mark Levinson. the closest thing I can find is the no 434 amp that makes 125wpc @ 8ohms. Each amp is $4,400. So thats $22,000 per speaker and $44,000 per pair.

What if you said- lets just get something else to drive the woofers- how about Krell- thats another big name. Their 350Mcx amp will do 300wpc. They are $6,000 each. So lets just add that up $6,000 for the Krell and $8,800 for the 2 ML amps= $14,800 per speaker or $29,600 per pair in amplification.

Lets add that up, since the hybrid approach was less expensive, lets stay with that. We have the Meridian 8000s at $45k and the Brand X High End's at $20k (remember, they could be more expensive). Now lets add the cost of the amplification to get a total of $49,600. Not too far off the Meridians. But theres more work to be done. We havent addressed the room correction nor the digital crossovers nor the ir capabilities.

Of course you could say- I know how to build amps or I can make do with less expensive amps. But we're talking about high end speakers and their owners want to see high end amps with them.

Lets address the room correction- the only one I know of is the Tact and it retails for around $3k for 2 channels. You of course have to get the signal into it digitally, so you will need an a-d convertor- and then a d-a convertor. I believe Tact makes a 2 channel one for around $650. Lets assume they also make a d-a for around the same price (I have no idea on this one). So thats about $4,300 for room correction per pair. Now this is far above what the 8000s can do in room correction- but it is the closest I can find.

So where were we? Oh right, we're adding up our costs. We have the 8000s at $45k and the Brand X super dooper setup at $4,300 for room correction + $49,600 = $53,900. Getting a little north of those 8000s now. But theres still more.

We have to find digital crossovers- or at least active crossovers. You know what I got when I typed in "digital active crossover" into Google? "Meridian DSP5000 Digital Active Loudspeaker" lol. I cant find much on this that makes much sense at first look, so lets just suppose we have to go with an analog active crossover and that it costs $750 per crossover. Each speaker has 3 so thats $2,250 per speaker/ $4,500 per pair.

Do the math to get $4,500 + $53,900 = $58,400.

Whats left- to get the IR repeater ability. Lets say you can get that from Radio Shack for $30.

Wait a minute- no self respecting audiophile would maks such purchases without spending some money on cables. Lets leave out the really absurd stuff and just budget $1k for all the cables per pair. The 8000s come with cables and the oft discussed MSR (remote control- if you want to penalize Meridian do it for the MSR- its not the greatest remote control, but it works).

So the grand total is:

DSP8000s: $45,000

Brand X Super Dooper Speaker: $59,430.

But we're not quite done. There are 2 unquantifiable costs. Convienence in the form of setup and support. The 8000s show up in some pretty big boxes but after that its pretty easy. Our Brand X Super Dooper Speakers will be a labor of love. For some, it will be a wonderful adventure. For others it will be an ordeal. Which one would it be depends on who it is and where they are in their lives. For me, I dont have the time to mess around with all that stuff- Im too busy here!

So in the end you can get a similar (perhaps slightly better or worse) result to the 8000s- but it will be a mess of wires, it will likely cost you more- certainly in time- and you wont have a unified tech support experience- something youre likely to need.

Now, I'm just doing this for the fun of the excercise- by no means am I an expert anad perhaps I have missed something. I think when you look at the situation as presented above, it turns out that the 8000s arent absurdly priced at all and are pretty unique. And yes, the downside of that uniqueness is that they really need to be pared with a Meridian surround processor. So if you add that in and figure $20k for an 861 and $10 for another high end processor (Im being generous here- its probably more like 12-15k) you get:

Meridian 2 Channel System: $65k
Brand X 2 Channel System: $69.5k

This is partly what I thought about when I made my choice. I came to the conclusion- over many years- that the Meridian system is an extremely elegant and sophicistated setup. I hope it helps others.

It just occured to me that the price for our Brand X speaker has to go up a little because each 8000 will automatically upsample any incoming signal to 96/24- if it isnt that already. So we need to budget some more dollars- but the point has already been made so Ill leave it at that.

[This message has been edited by JerryL (edited 11-23-2003).]