Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems 861 room correction

Yeah, I just updated my speaker software and noticed a significant improvement in sound quality even before the v4 upgrade

DougS,
which SW version you have?
Its available on the M-homepage?

Tx
Robert

hi everyone-
yesterday we installed v4 in my room (4 8000s, 3 7000s, high freq acoustic treatments)

We found a few interesting things and because we did all this relatively quickly, its hard to say what change produced what improvement- but I would go along with what everyone else is saying: the v4 upgrade before RC is a big improvement- things sound clearer, more focused, like Deniz and the others have said. yet in my room, which was designed to have good sound, we found the bottom end bass on music, and especially on movies was still too much. as an aside, I found that with v3 I needed to set the LFE channel to -18! That is because I had the 8000s set to large and the 7000s set to small, so the LFE channel was getting split equally to the 8000s. I measured this as the proper setting by my ears and also with video essentials Dolby digital tests. I was amazed that I could get it right by ear.

We then did the room correction and we found the sound definitely became even clearer but the bottom end bass still seemed too overpowering. Each channel used 8 filters. I think the problem areas were in the 50-80hz range as well as maybe the 230hz range.

We found a big improvement if we designated each speaker as having a boundary- the bottom end bass became a lot more controlled. my 8000s are about 4' from the side walls and about 1' from the wall behind them in the front, and about 3.5' and 6" from the wall behind in the rear. the 7000s are about 6" from the wall behind the speakers.

I was advised that I should also designate the 7000s as large. I was worried that the 7000s couldn`t go low enough and why not take advantage of the 8000s basically being really nice subs + a head unit, but we gave it a shot. I am told that all the digital speakers have a version of Meridians protection circuit in them so one shouldn`t worry too much. this plus the change in boundary setting really tightened things up. gone was the bottom end fuzz. But then it occurred to me- wouldn`t the boundary setting affect the RC calculations? the answer is yes.

so we ran the RC again- with the DSP speakers and a sony vaio laptop from 3 years ago (p3, I forget the processor speed, but its now considered slow) the entire RC process took maybe 15 minutes.

the result now was really clear bass all the way down. as someone said "now it sounds as it should".

Our demo material was Dark Side of the Moon (the hybrid SACD/CD) and Star Wars Episode 2 (opening scene and then lightsaber battle). we thought at -18 the LFE was too low so we tried various settings and left it at -10.

last night I ran VE again and discovered it should be at -13. It`s hard to pin point why we were able to raise it. on one hand we increased the number of LFE sources from 4 to 7. But on the other hand we have a whole new software version in the 861 (v4), we have the RC going and we set the speakers to boundary. My guess as to what`s going on here is that the boundary setting took away some of the "bass loading" that must have been occurring and that has given me a more even bass distribution and the difference in LFE settings shows that.

another thing that might be of big interest to us here is the affect of upsampling dd and dts. before the v4 update to the 861, when I had the 800 decode dd or dts and then the 861 upsample them there was a distinct lack of bass in the resulting sound. and it was not just the LFE channel. I measured the LFE channel as being 10db lower than if the 861 decoded the bitstream. Even though the resulting sound had superb sonics- there is a sense of air and in the high end it was very "dramatic"- I didn`t use it because movie soundtracks lacked the "punch" I think they should have. My pet theory was something was amiss with the dd/dts decoder in the 800.

With the v4 upgrade, at least in my system, I can tell you the resulting sound suffers no such problems. It`s all there plus the great open sound that the upsampling produces. I did measure and verify this with VE. so it seems my theory was wrong, but what was it? I don`t know and at this point I only care as a matter of curiosity. I`m sure one day I/we shall find out.

So at the end how does it sound? absolutely fantastic! I can't believe I have this system in my home.

I listened to the Rent soundtrack last night. Its truly like the artists are standing in front of you. I then ran through some star wars (Laserdisc of Episode 4 using thx ultra 2, which sounded really good) and episode I pod race, which proved to me the bass was not lost in the upsampling as I`ve seen this scene hundreds of times. I flipped between the multi channel input which is the upsampled sound and the single digital input which has the non-upsampled sound and so far as the impact of the bass, there is no difference. the big difference is that the sound is even clearer and more open. this helps with things like cymbals, voices, and even certain drums (I don`t know the name but the kind that sound like thunder).

I also decided to watch the "depth charge" scene in U-571, I ended up watching the entire movie instead. Wow! Voices are crystal clear, music is spacious and delightful and the explosions- I honestly felt exhausted after that depth charge scene- which is how I think the director intended it. I really didn`t want to get up to go to sleep, but reality intrudes.

to try to explain RC in quantifiable terms, in my system, it`s like the difference between a great speaker on day 1 and the revised version from several years in the future- or between a top of the line speaker and the mid range of that product. its not like going from listening to music on a AM radio with 1 speaker to a solid receiver and speaker setup, but it is noticeable and for the audience here, it will likely be a subtle, yet not a small improvement in many rooms.

Another point to make on the RC is that its amazing how powerful a tool this is and how easy it is to use. If you can use windows and a SPL, you can use MRC (Meridian Room Correction). The level of sophistication Meridian puts in our hands is immense and that it is easy to use is a testament to their not putting out something before its truly ready. For all our "heartache" over the past several years about "where`s the RC"? and "others have RC" I say- I think Meridians implementation is the best too date and the wait was well worth it.

For the relative little money that the upgrade costs, if you have an 861 already, I think you would be literally insane not to get this upgrade.

It seems to me that with each version of a Meridian product, the performance is wonderful and leaves one to wonder: can it really get any better than this? And always, my answer is: no, it doesn`t get any better. But Meridian shows there is always room for improvement and sets the bar even higher with the new version. And now I am left to wonder- does it really get any better than this? I have to strongly say NO- this is so good it has to be as good as it gets- and its so good- and that makes me smile, but what really gets me grinning all the more is the realization is that this is as good as it gets............. **for now**

Well done! highly recommended!


[This message has been edited by JerryL (edited 07-03-2003).]

My speaker software version is 5.03
To the best of my knowledge it is not available on Meridian's website.

That is a really nice write-up Jerry. What size is your room? (You have 30 woofers in there. )

Agree..I really enjoyed the read. No surprise that the low f's have to be managed then eh ?

Rgds

Nick

Thanks guys.

the room is approx 28.5' L x 18' in front/ 19.5' in rear W x 9.5' H in front/ 7.5' H in the rear.

Happy Fourth of July!

[This message has been edited by JerryL (edited 07-03-2003).]

Jerry,
Intersting post. I have the same experience with V3 and lack of punch when i let the 800 decode. I ifrst thought i imagined it, and since i am more working on the room than watching movies i did not care that mucht. Glad this will be solved with V4, which i still have not received...

Jaco

Me either, Jaco.I ordered V4 over a month ago and still no sign.Can't wait tho. I have a long way to go before my own room is completed so any improvements R.C can bring are very welcome.Also my V3 has not been very reliable ( I've posted previously about 'Upsampling' failure) and I hope V4 will solve this.
After Jerry's post I am strongly tempted to set speakers ( except Centre) to boundary.I too have found either too much bass (dts,Direct) or too little (Cinema).

Regards,
Manus

Jaco, I still exhibit this lack of bass issue even with V4/RC. Whenever I playback a title in DD I tell the 800 not to decode the bitstreams to get back my low end.

Another clear example of this is while I watched "Mask Of Zorro" superbit last night. I first selected the DD option with the 800 not decoding, then the 800 decoding with a clear loss of bass. If I choose the DTS format then I notice no losses either way.

Hi Guys

Are any of you aware if this DD lack of bass issue is prevalent with a 598/568.2 combo when upsampling? I'm working towards this combination specifically for this feature, but if it's compromised by the bass problem, I'd rather know before parting with the hard-earned!. Comments welcome!

Thanks

George

Deniz

Have you set your channels levels using the built-in tones or with another disc, like Avia?

Also, can you measure with Avia using 800 decode and 861 decode and tell us if the levels are different?

[This message has been edited by sspears (edited 07-04-2003).]