Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Naim -vs- Meridian -vs- Denon

Posted Wed 03 August 2005 22:27

Posted the following on the Naim forum - but thought people here might find it interesting:


Thought I'd post my thoughts having done some extended demos.

What caused this? Well, after my initial DVD5 probs. I was supplied with a 2nd machine. This has been failing to read CDs, culminating in a refusal to read the DVD5 software update CD! Feeling slightley upset, and having borne months of less than perfect service from my DVD5s I decided to investigate some altermatives, a Meridian G91 and the latest Denon behemoth.

The Meridian is a well put together machine. The G91 includes a stereo pre-amp and a tuner, in addition to the DVD - although for a thousand pounds more than the DVD5. My impression was that the picture quality was marginally better than the DVD5. But on a couple of DVDs, notably High Society, the picture wavered and distorted. Whilst on an episode of Buffy it lost the image sharpness.

I enjoyed playing the pre straight into one of my 250s. On the whole I was quite impressed with the sound quality.....BUT, 'oxymoron warning', on listening to Rex Harrison sing in My Fair Lady it sounded compressed. I fed the signal into the AV2 and the compression vanished.

The Denon is a BIG beast. It performed faultlessly, playing DVDs, DVD-A and SACD. The picture quality was excellent, and I think shaded both the DVD5 and the Meridian.

In terms of audio the SACD is excellent. This is the first time I have heard why people fuss about this format. CD was interesting. I use the Benchmark DAC1. Other users have commented that the DAC1 is transport agnostic. Well I found NO difference between the Denon's internal DACs and the DAC1, but neither was captivating. Similarly DVD-A was acceptable, but lacked excitement.

With the Denon I found musical passages that hit a resonance with the DVD5 didn't on this box. For instance, in Pride and Predujice there are two instances of music being played by live period instruments, on the DVD5 I found this musically interesting - on the Denon it was just incidental music. That said I thought the Denon was better at presenting the surround effects.

One of my concerns with Denon is there frequent model changes. I spoke to Denon UK and voiced my concerns about getting a five year old model serviced - the person I spoke to had no words of reassurance.

Switching back to the DVD5 I noticed that the picture quality is very good. Also when I could get the DVD5 to recognise a CD it's presentation is fantastic through the DAC1. I bought the recent release of War of the Worlds, as it is a hybrid SACD. I thought the SACD presentation via the DENON was excellent - but this was matched by the CD layer through the DVD5/DAC1.

So, where does that leave me?

I feel the Meridian is a sideways move - but understand why people like these boxes, my eldest daughter has fallen in love with the Meridian remote control!

The Denon is a good DVD player with a superlative picture - but poor medium term support. The SACD replay is very good, but CD and DVD-A is mediocre. However good the SACD is do I want to buy into what I think is a dying format? The DVD-video audio for film effects is very good, but for me failed to communicate the musical content.

Having done the rounds I have decided to give the DVD5 one last go. I do feel very frustrated. This a partially alleviated by Naim, in the person of Adam, and most especially by my dealership, Audio-T, and the support given me by Paul.

Fingers crossed - third time lucky?

Martin.

What are you running for speakers and amps?

Hooking an external DAC for DVD-A is sort of pointless with a G91. An external DAC attached to any box doing SACD is also kind of silly.

What DVD-A and SACDs did you evaluate with?

A lot of hear went through many brands before we arrived at Meridian. It takes a while to understand and appreciate what they have to offer.

I'd also suggest contacting Meridian if you have any DVD's that gave the G91 trouble. They often have beta programs going.

George,

Amps = Nap 250 front, Nap 250 rear, Nap 140 centre.
Speakers = ART Skibo front and centre, Linn Kan Mk2 rear.
Sub = REL Strata III.

The external DAC is for CD. I'm not sure what you mean by, 'An external DAC attached to any box doing SACD is also kind of silly.'

SACD and PCM processing are not synonymous. That a machine has great DSD processing doesn't preclude it from being sub-standard with 16/44.1.

Trying to describe sounds is not easy. I would say that in hi-fi terms the Denon is a good performer with the DAC1, and by itself, in that there is good seperation between instruments and singers, and in this sense it may be better than the DVD5. However, it didn't grab me. I could quite easily sit and read a book while it was playing - something that I would be constantly distracted from doing by the DVD5/DAC1.

The Meridian is a good machine. I enjoyed listening to it playing CDs using it as a pre as well into a 250. However, when I plugged it into the DAC1 it seemed to gain an octave of base and opened up generally.

I only listened to DVD-A via the G91 in stereo, as I had no facility to use the digital spdifs.

I've got about 10 DVD-As, including the usual suspects: Fleetwood Mac, Eagles, Sinatra, Alice Cooper et al.

Funnily enough I've got as many SACDs - in the form of Hybrid SACDs. Although I did buy the SACD (only) of Bat Out of Hell - which on the Denon sounded pretty good.

Bottom line is that I'm not convinced any high def format has a future - which is a shame. In fact as commercial companies gear for low res MP3s etc, and mix and produce for these formats, I wonder how much future CD has! Better send my LP12 off for another service.

I really liked all these machines, however I would consider any movement between them as a sideways step. BUT, in terms of picture quality, I use a 37" plasma - a projector with a large screen may tell a different story.

Martin

Multi-Channel DVD-A's mixed down to 2 channel don't sound that good.

I suspect you might think differently if you heard a good 5.1 or 7.1 DVD-A setup on Meridian equipment.

I think the DVD-A and SACD are both great, the problem is this MP3 that's taking up all the market for audio. Except SACD is a pain in the neck to work with.

I'm suprised you could see any difference on a 37" Plasma.

George,

The DVD-A I'm getting through my AV2 from the DVD5 is very good, as I didn't have a Meridian processor I couldn't do a comparison - and testing them within a Naim setup may not be a synergistic mixture.

My initial listening to hi-def formats was with a Pioneer 747ai, where I found the DVD-A was much better than SACD. The quality of the SACD on the Denon was an ear-opener to me.

I think the shame here is that the music industry is already producing some good sounding hi-def discs - where it took over a decade to make CD acceptable to my ears, although some of the instrument/vocal positioning can be interesting. Vinyl had massive market penetration - hi-def hardly makes a ripple in the UK. I doubt if the market is big enough to support small producers of DVD-A/SACD, but I hope I'm wrong.

I went into one of the major chains over here a week before the official launch of DualDisc (DD) - the staff didn't know what I was talking about. On the plus side they are stocking vinyl again.

Looking at some of the DD manufacturers they frequently ignore MLP for the 'hi-def' side.

For these reasons I am still concentrating my purchases on 2nd hand records and CDs.....and DVDs. But I do feel a sense of disappointment. Problem is IMO that the vast majority of people are more concerned with convenience over quality.

One thing I hunt for in the DVD arena is those with a PCM soundtrack - for instance the Rolling Stones Four Licks box set, sounds great through the DVD5/Benchmark DAC1.

Re: Plasma - That was the reason I mentioned it, it is material to my comments. I can see differences, and effects such as macro-blocking and chroma are apparent on any display - not that I noted any obvious problems with these three machines.

Martin