Meridian Unplugged - Powered by MrTechGuy.co.uk Forums Discussion Meridian - Systems Question about 568 (first series)

Probably a dumb question but can a 568 be used in conjunction with a stereo analogue preamp?

- I want to use the 568 not as the main preamp hub, but only when I watch movies.
- When I listen to stereo I want to use an analogue stereo preamp, and the 568 could be switched off altogther
- I have a Krell preamp with a 'Unity Gain' input, for 5.1 use. This input takes analogue-only volume increase/decrease directly from the volume control of another pre/pro, (in my case, the 568)and passes them onto the stereo amp.
- When I watch a film, the 568 would then also operate volume and sub levels normally into a separate 3 channel amp I have.

I could accomplish relatively seamless control of the units together using a Pronto.

The only thing I see not working in this configuration is sub control, because the 568 would be 'off line' when only stereo is in operation. I could get around this by sending a preamp out to the low level input of my REL sub, I think.

Can anyone see faults in what I'm suggesting?

Thanks in advance

Paul

Paul,

I can see this as being a PITA to maintain proper subwoofer levels.

As best I can tell from your description, you will have mulitple cables going to the REL, one as the LFE output from the processor, and two more from the stereo outputs of the stereo preamp.

That being the case, you will very likely need two different level settings on the subwoofer, one as LFE, one as subwoofer in a stereo context. Additionally, you'll need to define front L/R as large so that the subwoofer does the crossover for those speakers in all configurations.

When using the processor for LFE and bass management you should set the crossover to bypass / as high as it will go, unless you have a specific LFE input which does not engage the crossover circuitry. If you do have a specific LFE input, this configuration might work, but I am concerned with how you will manage the (likely) different levels for stereo through the stereo preamp and movies.

It will be difficult, though not impossible to make this work.

Good luck

Cheers,

Thanks John - I agree about the PITA factor!

The REL has several (3) inputs, and will handle a speaker level (ie power amp) input at the same time as a high level (ie LFE) feed or a low level feed (preamp) - however, there are not separate gain levels for each input - only one overall gain setting. It's a slightly older REL, Stentor II, without a bypassable crossover.

Please bear in mind that when the stereo pre is working, the 568 will NOT be supplying any bass via LFE at all, as only musical sources and not 5.1 will be playing. For example, I will connect a CD player direct to the Krell preamp & not through the 568.

The only things I will connect to/through the 568 are DVD and a satellite decoder - so, the 568 LFE should only be active for these sources right?

Multiple cables to the sub are not a big deal because of its relative location.

I have all speakers set to Large anyway, as recommended by REL, and in fact it sounds better that way, to my mind. I suppose if I played films really loudly I'd blow the rears and centre to pieces, but that is another issue entirely.

I think the issue will be, as you say, LFE on the 568 as well as the preamp BOTH supplying bass to the sub ONLY when I am watching a film. Is that right?

Supposedly the REL will handle this OK but I'd be in danger of having overblown, booming bass???

Thanks for any additional comments & your help so far.

Paul

I hate to bring this up, but your assumption seems to be that your Krell piece is a better stereo preamp than the 568. One might imagine a night of serious comparison to identify if you personally can hear a difference. If the 568 sounds the same, or better, why have the Krell? You could sell it, buy more DVDs and CDs, and be happier in the end w/o the PITA factor. Or, you could sell both of them and get a G. It would additionally allow you to have the SACD/DVD-A surround experience that the 568 is unable to provide. That is provided you have a universal player. I haven't auditioned the G68 yet, though imagine I shall in a couple of years. Krell seems to have better marketing to me, but does it have better sound to you?

Paul,

You don't specify what speakers you are using for main stereo LR.

I am mainly a two channel analogue purist who has always had reservations about feeding my vinyl front end through the Meridian Surround Controller inputs. Even on Direct, there is an analogue to digital and digital to analogue conversion before the signal reaches the power amp.

My system is configured as follows for the best of two channel vinyl enjoyment and multi-channel digital sources:-

Oxford Acoustics Crystal reference turntable/SME V/Koetsu Rosewood Signature mc cartridge into Tom Evans 'The Groove' phono stage/Tom Evans 'The Vibe + Pulse' line stage. The signal is then fed to a Chord SPM1200C power amp and then on to Amphion Krypton full range loudspeakers for the main LR. I take a high level signal output from the Chord power amp to a REL Stadium subwoofer.

I have a 598DP/568.2MM combo, the output of which (main LR out) I feed to one of the inputs of The Vibe line stage. This caters for my digital sources (DVD-A, DVD, CD etc.). I use Meridian M60C active centre channel and M60 active speakers for my rears.

I set up the main LR speakers on the 568.2MM as 'large analogue' with no sub. This way the REL enhances the bottom few Hz of the Amphion's capability.

I calibrate output to all speakers at 75db with the volume control on The Vibe set to 12 o'clock.

I can then use the remote to control the 568.2MM on CD, DVD & cable sources but leave it switched out when I am listening to records.

It all works very well and the Surround Controller does not compromise the vinyl source signal.

Regards,

Steve

I'm also in this dilema. I have the 568.2MM/598 combo and a Bryston BP25 with the MM phono stage. For sub management, I just found it easier to just buy a second sub. I keep my HGS12II tuned and dialed in with my B&W Nautilus 804s. That way I can have the sub anytime to help the 804s....music...movie...whatever. I picked up a HGS15II as my LFE sub to enhance movies. So that's how I got around the issue. I wish Bryston would look into a unity gain for the BP25 but alas they don't have any interest in doing the mod. So I'm stuck with trying my best to calibrate the mains referenced with the BP25 volume set in the 12 o'clock position.

pcavelle

I have what sounds almost the same as you.
I have 2 Rel Statium III's
I have a G68 for surround and a VAC tube preamp for stereo with cinima passthrou.
do you have 2 RCA connections on your Rel 0 or + 12db? I looked on there web site for your manual but no luck. See if you can upgrade the crossover I would think they would offer it, cause the new crossover make setup a breeze for what you are tring to do,

[This message has been edited by hevac1 (edited 05-18-2004).]

Thanks to all that have replied - very useful. It sounds as though I should be able to achieve what I'm after using the 'inatthebeginning'-type methodology.

For the person who asked, front speakers are Martin Logan SL3's, centre & rears are Martin Logan also. Amps are Krells all round, a 2 channel for the SL3's and a 3 channel for centre & rears.

With greatest of respect to 'navnurs' I've owned the 568 since it was released & whilst I think it's a very good preamp in its own right, I have only just bought the Krell preamp specifically to listen to music. I have thought long and hard about this but I now want to separate out stereo & video, going back to a dedicated stereo system with a dedicated CD player, and then have the 5.1/video side of things 'bolted on' to the stereo system, hence the reason I began this thread.

I also happen to believe that SACD & DVD-A are an utter waste of time and money and although I like the look of the G91 & G98 I won't pay the high admission price for features I never intend to take advantage of, like DVD-A. If Meridian had produced a DVD-Video player that scaled my video inputs to HDMI at 720p, I might have been their first customer. However, UK3500 is quite a lot to pay for a DVD player!

I've tried long and hard to get the Meridian CD/DVD preamp/processor sounding as good as I want it to but I firmly believe that in my rig it is better to separate out music & film, especially if you spend your time 50/50 on each. It is cheaper to get excellent video performance than excellent audio performance IMHO & I believe I can do this with non-Meridian components that provide the outputs I need for my projector at a reasonable cost. If you spend most of your time watching films then having a wholly Meridian based system is great.

Re the REL sub - it does have two RCAs (high and low level) but they are not controllable individually, and the sub crossover cannot be upgraded - I checked. Perhaps what I can do is retain the LFE input from the Meridian 568 and add-on the speaker level output & see what happens to the bass.

I am interested in any further comments anyone has.

Regards

Paul

Paul

I've had a seperate stereo/AV system for years, using switching on the pre-amp to switch the AV processor in and out of circuit, it's worked very well for me.

However, as a result of buying a 568.2 I've been able to combine and optimise the two systems. I tried the expensive analogue pre-amp route but got better beformance using an off board DAC with digital pre-amp functions. I realise that now you've bought the pre-amp you're reluctant to change course but it's worth exploring just to confirm that your chosen route is the right one for you. Get in touch if you want to come down and try it out, I don't have ML speakers but I do have Krell monoblocs and a Tact RCS so will probably be able to get the sound similar to your ML's. I've got a 602 and a G98 which you can compare with your current CD player (598?).

Gary,

Sorry to veer off at a tangent here, but how do you find your G98 vs the 602 now that you have had it for a few weeks?

Cheers

George

Hi George

I think the 602 has the better tonal balance and an 'analogue' quality that I'm told is due to the single beam laser mechanism used.

The G98 has better timing, a wider soundstage, better seperation of the instruments and generally has a more detailed presentation. It also exhibits a 'digital', 'glassy/course' type of sound on hi-hats and cymbals which took some getting used to.

As usual with an upgrade, it's 'swings and roundabouts' you gain in some areas and lose in others. The key point is that it is also a fine DVD player with extremely good picture quality on component output. For a single box DVD/CD transport it's very good. However, having listened to the Chord Blu CD transport and the dCS Verdi CD/SACD transport there is better CD replay available with similar qualities to the 602.

While a little unorthodox, my approach to this general problem (and to the fact that my old 565 could not bass manage correctly) was to essentially use speaker processors to do crossovers, bass management, etc, behind a 5.1 switcher preamp (Sony TA-P9000ES).
This has worked wonderfully. The P9000 also has a 2ch input for scenarios such as the above, and you also get the ability to add SACD players to the mix on a first gen 568 with this approach.

Read more details, and see a diagram of my rig at: http://www.mindspring.com/~jonfoulkes/BassManagement.html