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#272273 - 2018-01-25 12:02 218 options with Non-SL processors
Registered: 2013-11-24
Posts: 21
Bayreuth Offline
Harmless
Bayreuth Offline
Harmless

Registered: 2013-11-24
Posts: 21
Loc: Stockport, Cheshire, UK
Can the main digital channels 1&2 be output from a G61R (or other non-SpeakerLink surround processor e.g. 568.2mm) and passed through a 218 (and then to a powerAmp or active speakers)?

The nearly 50-Page post (#265341: “Meridian 218 Zone Controller Announced!”) discusses SL connection, which I believe can be set up to work. (I hope I got that reference correct.)

My (quite possibly maligned) understanding is that the surround processor would expect the volume level to be controlled by the 218 (e.g. like a DSP speaker, which I don’t have any of).

I would expect to be able to get 24/48 output as SPDIF to DigiOut 1&2 from a G61R and would expect 24/96 to need to be MHR, but does the 218 accept MHR on it’s digital input?

I suppose what I’m really asking is..
Can the 218 be set up to behave simply as a replacement for the Main Analogue Output L/R?

Assumption
For best stereo sound quality, it would be best to put a 218 after a G61R rather than before it.

Suggested Connections
G61R[DigitalOutputMainL/R] -> [DigitalInput]218
218[AnalogueOutput] -> stereo power amp
G61R[AnalogueOutputCentre&Sub] -> active speakers
G61R[AnalogueOutputRearL&R] -> stereo power amp

Other Comments
I don’t have a SpeakerLink processor.
The 218 looks really interesting: extremely flexible and a bargain at £750.
For me, stereo is more important than surround. (Music is mostly CD, some SACD (have only ever used the CD layer!), an increasing number of BD-A, some downloads. Some SACD & BD-A are also surround, but I’ve not heard them as such.)

Thanks for any input!
Paul


priorities: stereo music (primarily 'classical' / choral / opera)
boxes: various 500-series, DACs, G91 (+ non-M e.g. ELS-63)
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#272274 - 2018-01-25 12:10 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being

Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
Loc: West Yorkshire, England
I'm just trying to work out the exact reason that you want to add a 218 to your system. Are you wanting to use Sooloos or Roon to add network streaming into your system? If you're not, I'm not sure what purpose the 218 would serve for you.


Roon (ROCK NUC with internal SSD storage)
Meridian 218, DSP3200.
Lindemann Musicbook 20DSD and 55, PMC Wafer 1 (shared with Marantz SR7011 7.1 system).

Explorer 2.
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#272278 - 2018-01-25 14:40 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: JobSeeker]
Registered: 2013-11-24
Posts: 21
Bayreuth Offline
Harmless
Bayreuth Offline
Harmless

Registered: 2013-11-24
Posts: 21
Loc: Stockport, Cheshire, UK
Reply to JobSeeker:
Yes; mainly network streaming..

I realise that a MS200 would plug into a normal digital input of a surround processor (!) but wondered whether there would be an advantage to gain by using the 218 in a different way. Aside from stereo SQ vs the MS200 or vs a surround processor, for example, I am also interested in trying in an analogue system as just another input, replacing a Director & possibly the pre-amp. With 218 as the pre-amp, the surround processor could be left connected rather than physically swapping the inputs to the pre-amp. (Not a big deal to me; opinions of others at home may differ!)

FYI I do plan to demo Roon (via laptop endpoint) in the near future. I have also been tempted by low prices on MC200s. I would demo the 218 before purchase. I would also like to try MQA at some point.


priorities: stereo music (primarily 'classical' / choral / opera)
boxes: various 500-series, DACs, G91 (+ non-M e.g. ELS-63)
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#272282 - 2018-01-25 15:41 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being

Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
Loc: West Yorkshire, England
Whilst there are people on here using 218 with a Meridian processor, I suspect most are using DSP loudspeakers, so they probably aren’t doing what you want to do in your analogue system.

If you want to hear full MQA with minimum interference in the signal path, then the 218 would have to act as a preamp and feed it’s analogue outputs directly into your power amp.

If you can settle for just the first MQA unfold, then I THINK if you just use the 218 as a network endpoint and connect the digital output to an input on your G61R, then you would get an MQA first unfold digital signal sent for decoding by the G61R DAC . You could feed the 218 analogue outs at fixed volume into an analogue input on the G61R, but obviously the MQA decoded analogue signal will go through a further analogue to digital to analogue process before emerging from the G61R to your power amp. You need Meridian Comms too though really. I actually fed an MS200 into a G61R using a Speakerlink to SPDIF+C5 comms converter built for me by Syles.

I’m now trying to think about the 218 between the G61R and your power amp. If you connect the digital out for l/r front channels from the G61R into the digital input of the 218, with the 218 then converting to analogue and feeding your power amp, I’m trying to work out how you match the gain with the channels that the G61R is acting as preamp for, plus get comes up and running. It’s just making my head hurt at the moment.


Roon (ROCK NUC with internal SSD storage)
Meridian 218, DSP3200.
Lindemann Musicbook 20DSD and 55, PMC Wafer 1 (shared with Marantz SR7011 7.1 system).

Explorer 2.
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#272283 - 2018-01-25 15:50 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2004-12-09
Posts: 6,285
ChrisLayerUK Online content
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ChrisLayerUK Online content
President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2004-12-09
Posts: 6,285
Loc: Colchester, Essex, UK
This is Meridian's problem. There is no MQA path for those with Processors like the G61R et al.

I use Roon to an MS200 with an IfI power supply into my G61R playing Trifield to great effect.

The 218 is no use to us at the present.

Apparently Roon will be decoding MQA soon. (Actual time line is not known) This is the way I shall be doing MQA in the short to medium term in my system as it’s a no cost option for me.

How I see it is, Roon would send 88/24 or 96/24 MQA files at best, (there are 44/48 MQA files also) to my MS200. This will be a great source for my system. I can then compare Trifield and Stereo but it has to be an improvement over CD quality.
I have to say even undecoded MQA files sound great on my system now.

You can buy a lifetime Roon license for less than the price of a 218. I am led to believe the option to buy the lifetime option will not last forever but again, I don’t know anymore on this.

Thoughts, Chris


No 18 in the Hall of fame smile I have simple tastes; I am content to settle for the best: GIK monster bass panels, rear wall.
MC200 500GB, QNAP TVS 471i3. Roon into 2 MS200's. Explorer 2. Bluesound Pulse 2 and Mini. 596 v1.89.2, 518, G61R, M60.2 Rosewood, M33C, M33 Rears, M1500 Sub, Foxsat HD, Sony Blu Ray, Pioneer 5090, 2 Chromecast's for LRB videos.
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#272286 - 2018-01-25 17:06 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2009-04-06
Posts: 144
Ruben Offline
Hitchhiker
Ruben Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2009-04-06
Posts: 144
Loc: Florida, USA
I would try the 218 as a processor using the analog L and R output to a stereo power amp to the ESL63. Then get a QNAP and install Sooloos. You will get Full MQA.
If you are a stereo guy you do not need anything else. You can connect a Turntable also.


218, AC12, DSP5500 24/96LR, AppleTV, Sony blu-ray player (BDP S570) and
QNAP TS-251 and a PC
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#272287 - 2018-01-25 17:51 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2017-06-23
Posts: 9
Roffie Offline
Harmless
Roffie Offline
Harmless

Registered: 2017-06-23
Posts: 9
Loc: London, UK
I'll try to keep this brief, my experience of wanting to bring up to date my hifi setup led me to buy a 218.

I have a G61SL and wanted to experiment with a possible new pre-amp (low power standby,etc) that encompassed streaming MQA et al. The 218 after a few setup hiccups began to deliver the goods, Hi-res, MQA all good but after a several sessions I started to feel something was missing.
I reinstated the G61SL direct to the power amp and harmony returned.
The 218 delivered the hi res but for me, began to get tiring after playing for over 30 mins.

I reverted to G61SL processor using the 218 and everything was good but somehow I felt swizzed I was not benefiting from the full hi-res/MQA experience.
I bought an Explorer 2, and in my system, it felt marginally less good than the 218 but not significantly so.
After much deliberation I returned the 218.

I hoped the UHD722 may provide the solution but that looks unlikely to not.

I've decided to calm down, breath, meditate, lose the upgrade bug, and enjoy the wonderful music and feelings my system currently gives me.


G61SL, Naim NAP175, Kef XQ30 / 50 combo.
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#272289 - 2018-01-25 18:38 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2000-11-01
Posts: 2,620
RobertW Offline
Robert.W Great Green Arkleseizure
RobertW Offline
Robert.W
Great Green Arkleseizure

Registered: 2000-11-01
Posts: 2,620
Loc: Austria, Europe
Paul,

As I have a HH that wants a similar application just with the 861v4, I tried the 218 with my 568.2 (fw 2.59) and 5500 Speaker.

1)
The 218 is connected to the router,
the MASTER SL out goes via CAT/SL cable to the 240 degree DIN/comms plug that is placed at the 568.2.
From the 568.2 a standard M5-lead go the master DSP.
Comms is working either via MSR / 218 app / Roon / front panel on 268 (typo) 568

2)
Or audio can run as above or RCA but then you only have comms using the front panel and MSR to the 568.2.
So to get comms also via ROON and 218 app, you have to add a proper SL to DIN 5p 240 degree connector (not 180 degree).

3)
Connect the SL/Cat cable to the Slave comms on the 218, the same with comms as in point #2.

4) AC12 works similar- have not tested it.

Good luck


861v6+ID40/800v3/3x8k.2/3x5k5s smile /2x5kC/ 218/Explorer/TT-ELP/Trinnov Amethyst
__HB-strip, Ayon/HB/Shunyata/Dream State Audio/Miltzow -- power cables,
__Ayon/Jungson/Miltzow --analog, Miltzow-- digital,
__WMA/Finalizer- , iPad air, Macbook-pro.
Reviver
Edited by RobertW; 2018-01-25 21:11.
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#272304 - 2018-01-25 22:31 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Bayreuth]
Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
I have a 218 between my G68 processor and mono amps.

Digital out from the G68 to digital in on the 218.
Roon via Ethernet into the 218 network.
Table phono stage into the 218 analog in.
Analog out from the 218 to the monos.
Din comms / SpeakerLink comms cable from the G68 to the 218.
Control via G68/MSR/iPhone

I use the 218 for stereo 196k MQA and stereo from the turntable.
I use the 218 in combination with the G68 for HT duties.

Works fine.


HT: G68ADV w/LPS, HD621, DSP5000 F&C 24/96, DSP3100, Allo digi
Office: Fanless 7i5 running ROCK, 218, Woo Audio WA2 (w/50yo Tung-Sol tubes), Focal Utopia
Family Room. Grandinote Volta, Ultra rendu w/LPS 1.2, Prime with PSU, Grandinote Shinai
Bedroom: MRendu w/IsoREGEN, 568.2mm, 598, 3100C
BBQ/Party: Raspberry Pi, Explorer 2, F80
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#272305 - 2018-01-25 22:47 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: Struttmaster]
Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being
JobSeeker Offline
Pan-dimensional being

Registered: 2007-05-19
Posts: 1,005
Loc: West Yorkshire, England
So is the gain of the 218 and the G68 an exact match for the same number on the volume scale, they just match each other’s volume via comms when you operate the volume control (eg 65 on both)?


Roon (ROCK NUC with internal SSD storage)
Meridian 218, DSP3200.
Lindemann Musicbook 20DSD and 55, PMC Wafer 1 (shared with Marantz SR7011 7.1 system).

Explorer 2.
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#272306 - 2018-01-26 01:02 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: JobSeeker]
Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
I’ve got a 5000C. The volume goes up and down on that in unison with the front analogs no probs when I’m watching movies or listening to Trifield using any of the volume control devices.
Sounds fine to me but expect there are settings in the 218 config that can be used to fine tune things.


HT: G68ADV w/LPS, HD621, DSP5000 F&C 24/96, DSP3100, Allo digi
Office: Fanless 7i5 running ROCK, 218, Woo Audio WA2 (w/50yo Tung-Sol tubes), Focal Utopia
Family Room. Grandinote Volta, Ultra rendu w/LPS 1.2, Prime with PSU, Grandinote Shinai
Bedroom: MRendu w/IsoREGEN, 568.2mm, 598, 3100C
BBQ/Party: Raspberry Pi, Explorer 2, F80
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#272308 - 2018-01-26 01:11 Re: 218 options with Non-SL processors [Re: JobSeeker]
Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker
Struttmaster Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2016-11-27
Posts: 192
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
Hi job seeker,

When the 218 volume on the IP remote is say 65, the 5000C reads the same and they remain I in unison during volume adjustments.

It turns on automatically and switches to digital in when watching movies and listening to CD's using the G68 buttons.

When I want to play a record or stream Roon I use the IP remote to change the 218 input to analog or SLs.


HT: G68ADV w/LPS, HD621, DSP5000 F&C 24/96, DSP3100, Allo digi
Office: Fanless 7i5 running ROCK, 218, Woo Audio WA2 (w/50yo Tung-Sol tubes), Focal Utopia
Family Room. Grandinote Volta, Ultra rendu w/LPS 1.2, Prime with PSU, Grandinote Shinai
Bedroom: MRendu w/IsoREGEN, 568.2mm, 598, 3100C
BBQ/Party: Raspberry Pi, Explorer 2, F80
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