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#272227 - 2018-01-24 00:20 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Marc Koval]
Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless

Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Loc: Los Angeles, CA, USA
The Shunyata products are completely passive, so I don't see how they could ever "fail" and reduce the current being provided to the DSP speakers. I suppose active conditioners like the Audioquest or PS Audio units could, so maybe they should be avoided.

Since my original post, I've replaced the Denali on my speakers with another Triton V3 (I already had one on my digital sources across the room). The Triton V3 supposedly has greater transient current delivery capabilities and isolates each of the three outlet banks from each other, and I must say I found it to be a significant improvement over the Denali. Again, my electrical system is pretty rudimentary, so I don't know if everyone would get the same level of improvement. And I have both Tritons physically isolated on top-of-the-line Harmonic Resolution stands (for some reason, they're very sensitive to what they're sitting on).

But even my wife -- who is a very casual listener at best -- noticed the music coming from the system sounded clearer and more natural and wondered why.

Just saying.

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#272240 - 2018-01-24 08:06 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Cleop]
Registered: 2004-08-07
Posts: 7,454
Ian Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
Ian Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2004-08-07
Posts: 7,454
Loc: Surrey, England, UK
Originally Posted By Cleop
The Shunyata products are completely passive, so I don't see how they could ever "fail" and reduce the current being provided to the DSP speakers.
...
The Triton V3 supposedly has greater transient current delivery capabilities and isolates each of the three outlet banks from each other,
Is that a contradictory comment?

Sounds like the issue is that, in some fail conditions, Meridian DSP speakers rely on the main fuse blowing and having enough current on tap to achieve that. So anything that can limit this current draw may defeat this safety measure.

I appreciate that transient current is different to continuous, but a timed blow fuse will blow only with a non transient overcurrent event, so the issue is whether the supply can deliver the current required for enough time to blow the fuse.

So not sure how 'completely passive' and not reducing current to speakers vs allowing 'greater transient current delivery' does not mean that there is some current restriction possible.

Hopefully, these devices will not restrict continuous current to below that needed to blow the internal fuse.


Meridian owner since 1992
DSP5000 96/24, MC200, Prime & PSU, Focal Elear, Explorer 1 & 2, F80, 200/203 and various Sonos.
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#272251 - 2018-01-24 15:12 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Ian]
Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
ncpl Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ncpl Offline

President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
Loc: Surrey, UK
I measured instantaneous current potential out of my wall outlets and the Denali. There was no issue there. These were not the same noise measurements I shared in my review post a few months ago.


Rgds,
Nick

#15SE
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#272252 - 2018-01-24 15:33 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: ncpl]
Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,325
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic

Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,325
Loc: nr. Milton Keynes, UK
How did you do that Nick?


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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#272256 - 2018-01-24 17:23 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: VirusKiller]
Registered: 2016-05-04
Posts: 171
Ogri Offline
Hitchhiker
Ogri Offline
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Registered: 2016-05-04
Posts: 171
Loc: London, UK
I’m not going to get an answer (I’ll draw my own conclusions), still interested in the theory though? Innocent enough question.

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#272258 - 2018-01-24 17:54 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Ian]
Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless

Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Loc: Los Angeles, CA, USA
When I said the Triton V3 has greater transient current delivery capabilities, I meant in comparison to the Denali. But you're right -- theoretically, anything placed between the speakers and the wall could have some effect on the amount of current being delivered to the speakers.

On the other hand, you could also say that about the quality of the power cord (the relatively cheap stock cord that comes with the speakers probably won't have the same currenty-carrying capacity or low impedance characteristics as a well-engineered aftermarket 6-guage cord), the quality of the wall outlet (a cheap Decora outlet with nickel-plated bronze contacts probably won't transfer current as effectively as a Furutech outlet with rhodium-plated pure copper contacts), or even the quality of the wire in the wall (thin, stranded wire probably won't be as good as thicker solid-core wire). The question is, where do you draw the line?

I think what Marc was getting at -- and he can chime in here -- is that gross current-delivery anomalies could impair the speakers' self-protection design, which is why Meridian historically has recommended against AC line conditioners. Perhaps that's also why Meridian apparently felt Shunyata's older models (which were likewise passive units but ostensibly not as good at passing current as today's designs) wouldn't do any harm (which admittedly is a far cry from an endorsement)?

Of course, the crux of the matter is not just whether the Shunyata products do no harm (although, that's certainly important), but whether they're a worthwhile addition. In my system, I believe they are.

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#272263 - 2018-01-24 23:01 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: VirusKiller]
Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
ncpl Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ncpl Offline

President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
Loc: Surrey, UK
With a meter Joel. Typical electrician should have one.
Guillaume (the UK distributor) had one and we tested various sockets and combinations of things.


Rgds,
Nick

#15SE
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#272336 - 2018-01-26 17:21 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: ncpl]
Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
ncpl Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ncpl Offline

President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,436
Loc: Surrey, UK


Rgds,
Nick

#15SE
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#272338 - 2018-01-26 17:51 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: ncpl]
Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,325
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic

Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,325
Loc: nr. Milton Keynes, UK
Great, thanks.


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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#272342 - 2018-01-26 23:00 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: ncpl]
Registered: 2016-05-04
Posts: 171
Ogri Offline
Hitchhiker
Ogri Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2016-05-04
Posts: 171
Loc: London, UK
This is tongue in cheek right?

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#272362 - 2018-01-27 17:48 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Ogri]
Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless
Cleop Offline
Mostly harmless

Registered: 2010-10-13
Posts: 42
Loc: Los Angeles, CA, USA
Here's one explanation recently given at the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas by the designer of the Audioquest AC line conditioners (his presentation starts at 18:45 of the video).

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#272420 - 2018-01-29 16:47 Re: Power Conditioning on DSP8000SEs [Re: Cleop]
Registered: 2018-01-26
Posts: 1
NealXu Offline
Harmless
NealXu Offline
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Registered: 2018-01-26
Posts: 1
Loc: Ashburn, Virginia, USA
Hi..i am a new user here. As per my knowledge a timed blow fuse will blow only with a non transient overcurrent event, so the issue is whether the supply can deliver the current required for enough time to blow the fuse.

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