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#270677 - 2017-12-13 07:55 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: Jeje]
Registered: 2011-01-25
Posts: 407
bxd Offline
Hitchhiker
bxd Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2011-01-25
Posts: 407
Loc: Southampton, UK
Hi,

The current issue of Stereophile (and now no the website) has an article that might prove interesting for this discussion.

Brian


Main: G65, MD600, MS600, 218, 598DP, HD621, DSP5200SE, DSP5200HCSE, M6 & D1500.
System 2: G91A, MS200, DSP5000 (96/24v1), DSP3300.
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#270678 - 2017-12-13 08:17 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: bxd]
Registered: 2004-12-09
Posts: 6,147
ChrisLayerUK Online content
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ChrisLayerUK Online content
President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2004-12-09
Posts: 6,147
Loc: Colchester, Essex, UK
Is the the link?

MQA tested part 1


No 18 in the Hall of fame smile I have simple tastes; I am content to settle for the best: GIK monster bass panels, rear wall.
MC200 500GB, QNAP TVS 471i3. Roon into 2 MS200's. Explorer 2. Bluesound Pulse 2 and Mini. 596 v1.89.2, 518, G61R, M60.2 Rosewood, M33C, M33 Rears, M1500 Sub, Foxsat HD, Sony Blu Ray, Pioneer 5090, 2 Chromecast's for LRB videos.
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#270680 - 2017-12-13 09:29 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: ChrisLayerUK]
Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,230
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic

Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,230
Loc: nr. Milton Keynes, UK
From the horse's mouth: Question 7b and Bob's answer . A bit vague, but the question is still very valid. There *are* specific criteria for analogue kit being fed an authenticated MQA analogue output.


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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#270681 - 2017-12-13 10:26 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: VirusKiller]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
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Cliff. Offline
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Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
It not obvious to me how a lack of linear response at stupidly high frequencies (>30kHz)could result in perceivable time domain artifacts. It that referenced article (in 7b) worth following up?

Edit: my amp appears good to 50kHz and my speakers are good but only measured to 36kHz. My ears are the problem.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Edited by Cliff.; 2017-12-13 10:33.
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#270682 - 2017-12-13 12:07 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,230
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic
VirusKiller Offline
Don't Panic

Registered: 2004-04-15
Posts: 12,230
Loc: nr. Milton Keynes, UK
Originally Posted By Cliff.
It not obvious to me how a lack of linear response at stupidly high frequencies (>30kHz)could result in perceivable time domain artifacts.

If you are referring to a non-flat frequency response, you need to try and un-think what you have learned. It's the bandwidth that matters and, unless I've got it completely wrong, this applies equally to the bass sections (yes, 30kHz bandwidth important for reproducing 30Hz...).

Quote:
It that referenced article (in 7b) worth following up?

No, it's VERY statistical and a pig to read. The upshot is that it debunks the infamous Meyer and Moran (also AES) paper which "proved" that HiRes >RBCD was not audible (they completely failed to employ a test system with enough transparency).

Quote:
Edit: my amp appears good to 50kHz and my speakers are good but only measured to 36kHz.

As Bruce said above, the better the analogue gear, the better MQA will sound. My argument is that the science behind MQA hasn't – to date – been the driver behind the best analogue kit. I realize that this is a somewhat pedantic position to take, but I think that it's an important one: in the future much more kit will be designed with explicit time domain requirements. In any case, your amps and Giyas are fairly decent wink

Quote:
My ears are the problem.

Probably not. As Bob says, we may lose the top end of our hearing, but our audio acuity is an experience-based quantity.


Roon Developer and ex-moderator of this Forum
I am #25 in the HH1 photo of fame.
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#270683 - 2017-12-13 12:32 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: VirusKiller]
Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,352
ncpl Offline
President of the Imperial Galactic Government
ncpl Offline

President of the Imperial Galactic Government

Registered: 2002-02-14
Posts: 8,352
Loc: Surrey, UK
There are several papers that show that timing sensitivity is not degraded with age in the same way that frequency is. There is hope for all of us.


Rgds,
Nick

#15SE
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#270684 - 2017-12-13 12:40 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: VirusKiller]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
Thanks for the reply.

Originally Posted By VirusKiller
It's the bandwidth that matters and, unless I've got it completely wrong, this applies equally to the bass sections (yes, 30kHz bandwidth important for reproducing 30Hz...).

That's the bit I'm struggling with. I would have thought that all that mattered were the positions of the low and high frequency corners in the bandwith plot and also that the amp responded to signal amplitude changes equally over the frequency range. Amp design would surely play a major role for the latter.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
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#270690 - 2017-12-13 15:39 Re: Analogue Requirements For MQA Playback. [Re: ncpl]
Registered: 2011-02-02
Posts: 2,155
Hector Offline
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Hector Offline
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Registered: 2011-02-02
Posts: 2,155
Loc: Midlands, UK
Originally Posted By ncpl
There are several papers that show that timing sensitivity is not degraded with age in the same way that frequency is. There is hope for all of us.
Hate to disagree but in my case frequency increases with age, however timing is crucial for uninterrupted rest.

Seriously though can anyone provide detail on the bandwidth range of Prime Headphone Amp.
Could only find this response to previous question in post #227413 reference answer from Bob.

Quote:
A7 ii. "Many of us have headphones." The Prime Headphone Amplifier, which has a very wide bandwidth and compact impulse response, is getting MQA decoding by firmware update. How cool is that!

Hector


AV: Thorens TD160B, SME, ShureV15MK2, 500, 598, 861v4, DSP7200.1LR, DSP3300HC Samsung UE55, SkyHD.
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