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#271449 - 2018-01-05 20:26 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Fitcaz]
Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Loc: Usually nr. Frankfurt, Germany
Originally Posted By Fitcaz
So it's just a re-badged HD621 with a 4K part ie a 2k switch now doubles to 4k with an extra input and output
Actually it quadruples the resolution, but that's just a technical detail. And don't worry, the functionality is already here and has been for years. It's just that Meridian’s way of doing it will show up in the near future and people will have to decide what's the best way to do it.

Originally Posted By Fitcaz
Well my Tesla is just a stopgap before my hydrogen fuel cell autonomous car arrives - in 20 years time.
You're missing the point. That car doesn't exist, it might in 20 years... maybe sooner, maybe later. 4k switching, pass through and decoding of new formats and channels has been around for a while and the majority of manufacturers targeting the home theater and custom installation market already support it.

Anything is a stopgap until something new comes around. 4k is a stopgap, same can be said for 8k. The point is, from a technological point of view the 722 is outdated already, the new technology is already available. I guess it catches up, but is still two steps behind. Reminds me alot about the HD621 situation when HD-DVD and Bluray came out and there was a looong wait for a solution to arrive and the solution was to decode in the source. This doesn't work anymore for everyone, since more and more devices just pass the bitstream. For new formats like Atmos, it doesn't work at all. Before the HD621 came out, I just bought another processor and used that for a while (in an analogue system). Thanks to Meridian and the 271 I could do the same now with my DSPs. The question is, do I want to... and I'm not alone asking this question.

Since Meridian doesn't share a future roadmap, there only seem to be three choices. 1.) Put the money into the 722 and replace it "soon" (by Meridian's standard that could be a long time though) with something that supports the new codecs and more channels. 2.) Leave things the way they are (3rd party switch + HDCP stripper + HD621) or replace 861+HD621 with a 271 + Trinnov/Datasat. I guess for those who don't mind to have something analogue between the source and the DSPs, any processor would work.

The existence of the 271 is what's making me wonder if we will get something more up-to-date in the future or they'll just tell people to buy a processor from someone else. For the latter, there really isn't a point investing in a 722 now, is there?


- Stephan
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#271450 - 2018-01-05 21:06 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Stephan]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
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Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
Why would you need to replace the 722 'soon'? If a processor that supports the new codes comes along from Meridian, surely the 722 would still be able to supply the required bitstream to the new processor. I don’t see why it shouldn't remain valid until it runs out of your desired HDMI upgrades. (And who needs 8K anyway?).

Edit: I agree with you on the timescale and the key decision (for those who give a s**t about the new codecs) is do you wait (probably several years) for M's contribution of jump ship via the 271 etc.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Edited by Cliff.; 2018-01-05 21:17.
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#271476 - 2018-01-06 14:10 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Fitcaz]
Registered: 2017-05-27
Posts: 117
_M_ Offline
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_M_ Offline
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Registered: 2017-05-27
Posts: 117
Loc: Manhattan, NYC, USA
Originally Posted By Fitcaz
Well my Tesla is just a stopgap before my hydrogen fuel cell autonomous car arrives - in 20 years time.
i guess the Marantz is that hydrogen fuel cell autonomous car available today at half the price of the junky tesla. (btw, would never ever equate M to the junky cash burn taxpayer subsidized scam that is tesla.)

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#271489 - 2018-01-06 18:05 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Loc: Usually nr. Frankfurt, Germany
Quote:
Why would you need to replace the 722 'soon'?
To make a free selection of sources. Not every source can decode newer codecs such as DTS-HD MA to 8 channel PCM. Then the only option that remains is lossy audio.
In the long run, more channels might become attractive as well (Atmos, etc.). But that of course requires a decoding solution which might or might not come.

Quote:
If a processor that supports the new codes comes along from Meridian, surely the 722 would still be able to supply the required bitstream to the new processor.
And that's the big question. Is it able to extract the audio bitstream of any of the new formats and pass it through to a future M processor? If it can do that, it's perfectly fine. If it can't, it will require yet another replacement.

Quote:
(And who needs 8K anyway?)
Need, probably no one, but then again who really needs 4k or 2k? There was a time, when laserdiscs to 7" CRTs made everyone smile. Later it was laserdisc with a quadrupler to 9" CRT, then DVD, at some point digital projection and so on. So who wants 8k? Probably alot of people, I certainly do. Of course we need more content and display technology to get better.


- Stephan
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#271491 - 2018-01-06 19:54 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Stephan]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
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Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
I think it’s highly unlikely that decoding of Atmos, DTS:X etc. will ever happen in the player - think about much data would be required (speaker layout, positions, gains, bass managment etc.) for 12+ channels. The player would have to be the processor as well. HDMI chipsets have allowed HD bitstream passthrough for yonks (3D codecs included) and I’d be amazed if the 722 didn’t support it when\if required.

As for 8k, pixel count already exceeds what’s visible for display viewing and IMHO it’s only VR applications that will benefit from higher pixel counts. Image processing is far more important. See this thread if you need convincing.


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Edited by Cliff.; 2018-01-06 19:58.
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#271550 - 2018-01-08 19:17 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker
Stephan Offline
Hitchhiker

Registered: 2003-09-23
Posts: 161
Loc: Usually nr. Frankfurt, Germany
Originally Posted By Cliff.
HDMI chipsets have allowed HD bitstream passthrough for yonks (3D codecs included) and I’d be amazed if the 722 didn’t support it when\if required.
To clarify, do you mean HDMI to HDMI passthrough (which I don't doubt at all) or HDMI into the 722, extracting the HD audio bitstream there and passing it through via MMHR to a future M processor (which I have my doubts about)?

Since the 722 has two HDMI outputs, another option would be to hook up one to TV/projector and the other into a future M processor, which would then require at least one HDMI input. Since Meridian always said they want to keep HDMI out of the processor, I consider this unlikely. Guess we have to wait and see what happens.


- Stephan
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#271556 - 2018-01-08 21:04 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Stephan]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
Yes, you’re right, nothing is certain regarding what will pass through the MMHR connection. (Although with the HD621, we do know that you can send two 2Ch bitstream via one Smartlink connection). Surely, M will make it happen if they do indeed bring out a more advanced processor and surely that can’t expect their customers to invest in further HDMI switching kit. However, at the present, the 722 is being sold as a 4K upgrade for their existing processors and should be purchased as such.

If you want Atmos etc. in a reasonable timeframe, IMHO the 271 is the way to go for a DSP speaker set-up. Looks like the new Trinnov 16 model has digital outputs (when they get enabled) so the price of an all-digital 271 solution is coming down (but still expensive).


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
Edited by Cliff.; 2018-01-08 21:18. Edit Reason: corrected number
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#271557 - 2018-01-08 21:18 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2017-05-27
Posts: 117
_M_ Offline
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_M_ Offline
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Registered: 2017-05-27
Posts: 117
Loc: Manhattan, NYC, USA
you mean the 271 for the Trinnov? surely not the 722?

it seems these new M numerical designations are confusing some here in a kind of dyslexic way; well, at least in my case...

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#271558 - 2018-01-08 21:19 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: _M_]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
Indeed. corrected


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
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#271561 - 2018-01-08 21:50 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2009-11-10
Posts: 1,162
CMB Integrations - Bruce Offline
Meridian Partner Pan-dimensional being
CMB Integrations - Bruce Offline
Meridian Partner
Pan-dimensional being

Registered: 2009-11-10
Posts: 1,162
Loc: Lexington, South Carolina, USA
I was told the Altitude 16 is analog only and will not have a digital option.


www.cmbintegrations.com

Personal System #1 Theta Digital Cassablanca 4, 818v3, 218, DSP8000.2SE, DSP7200SEHC, Boston Acoustics Lynnfield 500L series 2, Monitor Audio Silver 10, ATI 200WX5 Amp, JVC RS15, Black Diamond Zero Edge screen. QNAP TS-251 3TB
Personal System #2 F80.

Crestron control and multi room audio via Meridian 258 amplifiers.
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#271562 - 2018-01-08 22:15 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: CMB Integrations - Bruce]
Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer
Cliff. Offline
Senior Shouting Officer

Registered: 2004-04-23
Posts: 2,407
Loc: South Wiltshire, UK
The Altitude 16 has two AES67 audio outputs (when they’re enabled that is)


Main system - Sources (Kodi-HTPC, FireTV, Sat) into Trinnov Altitude 32 (8-16) (+Roon), Trinnov Amplitude 8 amp & Vivid Audio (Giya G3, V1.5) and REL Stentor III speakers. Others: F80 + Raspberry Pi and other Pi systems.
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#271563 - 2018-01-08 22:19 Re: UHD722 HDMI Processor 4K Switch [Re: Cliff.]
Registered: 2009-11-10
Posts: 1,162
CMB Integrations - Bruce Offline
Meridian Partner Pan-dimensional being
CMB Integrations - Bruce Offline
Meridian Partner
Pan-dimensional being

Registered: 2009-11-10
Posts: 1,162
Loc: Lexington, South Carolina, USA
Just what the Rep says.


www.cmbintegrations.com

Personal System #1 Theta Digital Cassablanca 4, 818v3, 218, DSP8000.2SE, DSP7200SEHC, Boston Acoustics Lynnfield 500L series 2, Monitor Audio Silver 10, ATI 200WX5 Amp, JVC RS15, Black Diamond Zero Edge screen. QNAP TS-251 3TB
Personal System #2 F80.

Crestron control and multi room audio via Meridian 258 amplifiers.
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